we quite often see a white boxer with his owner,who seems to be in some sort of souped up wheelchair,he's had it since a puppy,but is getting a bit old for the travelling the owner does in his chair,the dog is brilliant though,albeit a wee bit dog aggressive, but the muscle tone on him his marvelous, Wendy
my dad and my uncle both have boxers.First is josh he is brindle boxer then my uncle has his brother tug he is pure white and he has a full bill of health he can see and hear fine will he go deaf or blind as he gets older
I suspect (and anyone, please correct me if I'm wrong) that the risk to him is the same as any other dog is he is currently fine. Any dog can lose sight or hearing in old age.
Yes, agree with that. Defects caused by lack of pigment (whiteness) are congenital. I don't know of any evidence to suggest that whites are any more susceptible to age related degeneration than other colours.
White Boxers are not albinos. Albino dogs do not have any pigment. White Boxers are simply born with white hair
WOW how unbelievable!! I have two bobtails here, a different breed but they can run, turn and do all the things that a dog with a tail can. Oh and they've never lost their balance. I would never ever put a bob with a bob though, only tails go to my bobs and usually get half and half in the litter.
Interesting that deafness is linked to deafness....Dalmatians really have an issue with this didn't realise it extended to white dogs in general.
Perrodeagua - I'm confused - it says on your profile top right had corner that you have Spanish Water Dogs yet you talk about bobtail boxers, do you have Boxers as well? There will always be controversy over the White Boxer mores the pity. It should mean more to have a good healthy sound puppy than colour.
Would be interesting to know what has occured if any bob x bob mating have been done in your breed. According to Cattanach, bob x bob matings in Corgis have produced less than the expected number of bobs, but not reduced litter size, indicating that although the gene is lethal in double dose, death in utero is very early, before implantation, so numbers are compensated. There is though more than one type of bobtail gene, so no guarantee that your breed has the same.... there is now a gene test though I believe. Sorry, way off topic
OK, sorry to go off topic slightly, but last week I briefly spoke to a Boxer Breeder of 40 years from overseas, who said that boxers were originally white. I can't quote his research as I do not know, but is this true ? and if so, why are they so discriminated against, especially now as they cannot prove white has anything to do with any more incidence of deafness than in plains or flashies ??
Quite a few of the orginal boxers were white Although looking back they don't look much like the boxer of today. From 1896 [attach-center]3978[/attach-center] One reason I have heard is that white boxers were no good as guard dogs as they were easily spotted in the dark so they became unwanted over the darker reds and brindles.
Where has this come from Malady?! There is ample evidence to prove the white/deafness association across all affecteds breeds. The latest from Cattanach is that there is a 10% incidence of deafness in white Boxers, compared to levels no higher than normal in plains and flashies.
As I said I can't quote his own research, but have been following an old thread on another forum regarding white boxers and lots of research was posted there that included categorically that congenital deafness was just as likely in plains and falshies, as in whites. You cannot compare the deafness problem in white boxers to all other breeds, as each breed has a seperate gene responsible, so the gene affecting Dalmations may not be the same gene inherited by white boxers ! I believe research is still being done to determine mapping, so they can determine which gene is responsible in several breeds.
That goes against everything Cattanach has ever reported on this. He is a geneticist and specialist in Boxers. There are other types of deafness, apart from colour related, in dogs, and it could be that if someone has data collected from a small sample, say one particular kennel. This could include some coloured affecteds which would give a biased sample and shouldn't be taken as respresentative of the breed as a whole. All research so far indicates that there is no gene for colour related deafness. The gene is for white spotting, the S locus, and this is the same in any breed that has white markings. Both Boxers and Dalmatians have the sw allele, and when this occurs in double dose, white occurs. This applies to all Dalmatians of course. It is possible that there are more than two loci associated with this type of white, and the 'panda' GSD is one possible example of an alternative to S but there is absolutely no doubt that pleitropic effects of the white spotting gene are responsible for these defects. There is a wealth of info on the net to support this, not just from Cattanach but USA researcher Strain too.
THe research I talked about wasn't regarding just one kennel !! I'm not niave to think that worldwide research should be based solely on one kennel ! As far a I was aware the GSD has no spotting gene, just masked colour !! Cattanach is just one Genetesist of thousands and for as long as the human race exists, Genetesists the world over will agree or disagree with their findings ! They can never seem to agree ! I guess it depends on whether or not you have several sources which all agree or not, that determines what you beleive ! I wouldn't base a belief on one genetists alone.
Could you give a clue as to what this research is. PM me if you can't post a link Do a search for 'panda' Shepherds to see. Cattanach is unique in that he is the only geneticist/Boxer specialist researching this. All published work that I have seen on colour related deafness is in agreement on this. If you have evidence to the contrary, it would be very interesting to see. Do you have any links.. or maybe the researcher's name... or anything to back this up?
As I said there are lots of researchers/Genetisists, I don't have any now to link, as I don't have the time to go back and search through 20 pages of posts to find the links. As I said there are lots that will disagree and always will. However I remember one of them being a study on White Boxers and Ridgebacks ! I thought Cattanach was doing extensive research into Bobs not Whites !
I was also of the understanding the the 's' was only studied as a genetic problem if the dog was white AND had blue eyes. I wasn't aware that studies were conclusive regarding just white boxers !
Not quite sure what you mean by this. The S locus is one gene that causes sensorineural defects by removing pigment. The absence of pigment (white markings) in the hair, particularly in the head region, is an indication of missing pigment in the inner ear and it is this pigment that is crucial to the development of normal hearing. Missing pigment in the eye gives rise to blue eye. If pigment is missing in the eye it is more likely to be missing in the ear, hence the strong positive correlation between blue eye and deafness. But, the two don't always occur together. You can have blue eye without deafness and deafness without blue eye. Conclusive as to what?
