Do we know what we own? Discussions

i honestly dont know alot about OTB so i cannot answer that
But because ive deeply researched the stafford history then i can say if u take away any part of the stafford spirit then to me its not a true stafford

it dont mean you dogs has to be fighting everything going BUT when pushed it can turn nasty hence thats why we need to control it, if u cant do that then get away from our breed as u should know it lays underneath every stafford

I think we are going round in circles here, If hayley believe that taking away dog agression is taking away part of a staffy, then fair enough. I think all of us are going to disagree or agree and its not really solving anything??

More importantly Hayley I think we all need to know why you think Dog aggression should not be bred out and why you think it is a GOOD part of a Staffy?

Hi Hayley,

As a Stafford owner you like many others represent your breed (you may not like this but you know me I will say it anyway and really no offence is meant )

You are really not doing your breed much of a favour, the breed struggles enough as it is to get into everyones 'good books' its up to you as an owner to put people 'right' about your breed stating all the good points and the bad points about sharing your life with this breed. Never mind the Stafford Spirit that could be gone with the breed intself with everything thats being stated within this thread Because right now all this really isnt helping to put peoples faith into these fabulous dogs

Dog aggression is not part of the staffordshire Bull terrier's standard.
They should be Bold Fearless and totally reliable,this does not mean they should be aggressive.I believe when challenged by another they will stand there ground.
I have experienced a dog fight our two bitches started fighting,we don't know what triggered it,it was awful to watch and trying to part them was a nightmare,the only way we could part them was by choking them off each other.These were two that had grown up together,shared a bed together,infact did everything together,they had never shown any aggression towards each other or another dog.
I expected lots of noise,barking growling etc but there was none,just grunting like pigs,while they had hold of each other.
How idiots can get a kick out of using this breed to fight and get a thrill out of watching it is beyond me.I never ever want to experience another fight between two staffords or for that matter any dog.

As there is that risk, as with all dogs, then why not limit the risk by breeding out some of the tendancies?

As I've already said we have enough of a problem keeping staffords off the Dangerous Dogs list and educating people about the stafford without people encouraging that breeders do NOT breed out the aggression.

IMO anyone who feels that the aggression should stay in the breed is not a deserving owner of the stafford and doesn't truly love the breed

Well don't you think that is not the perfect solution (you have no other choice and are forced into doing that right?) And that it's not ideal for the dog either?

Wouldn't it be fairer on the dogs if they were allowed off lead and able to play and have fun like every other dog? Wouldn't that be a happier exisitance for them? Anyone who doesn't think so probably needs their head testing.

You are right there, I have no idea where you are coming from and why anyone would not want their dogs to live a healthier and happier life because their (if any) dog agression is removed.

He may not have but many of us do. Brundog has to live with this trait everyday, and she clearly states how much happier all of their lives would be if the intolerance of other dogs wasn't there. I have a large bull breed and I would feel much happier if I knew he could be let off lead where other strange dogs play - if another dog did start a fight he'd just come back to me.

BTW there is a difference between a dog defending itself and a dog intent on 'eliminating' the opposition once it's 'switched'. So remvoing the aggression doesn't mean your dog turns into some sort of lifeless entity, it just loses that horrible nasty charcteristic that was bred into it by idiots many many years ago - and everything else that makes these dogs great, remain.

Hayley are these the same dogs that WERENT WATCHED and mated in the not to far distant past??

What happens if god forbid something happened to you and god forbid you wernt around anymore to control your dogs, do you have people who are happy to look after them and watch them 24/7 to ensure they dont fight each other if you were in hospital or something or godforbid if you were no longer able to look after them would someone else happily take on your dogs as they are or would they end up in dogs homes less desirable because they are dog aggresive?

Couldn't agree more Dani, Syd's best mate is a dog aggressive staffy belonging to SBT, I think his only mates are Syd and Rio that he can be trusted to play with off lead. I don't think his is fear aggression but I don't really know, he is an absolutely gorgeous dog with my 2 but you can never relax and be off guard, because other dog owners see the 3 of them playing and you would never know there is a problem, they walk over to join in with their dog and Louie has to go on the lead immediately. He ends up walking the dog on his own as his wife hates the way Louie is around other dogs and was really shocked when she saw him playing with my 2 as she didn't think it was possible. How can it be a pleasure to walk your dog when you have to be constantly on your guard, and how sad is it when dogs can not enjoy playing and running with other dogs.

Well put! My sisters staffy is dog aggresive he has accepted a staffy pup and is so much happier and loves her to bits, I cant take loki to my sisters house which means I hardly get to see her just because her dog is dog aggressive and before you say its us his dog aggression effects not him and if she cant deal with a dog aggressive dog she should have one, her dog was a rescue and she takes all neccesary measures to control his aggression and to try to work on it and as sad as it is that we miss out on seeing each other the real shame I think is that her dog and mine will never get to play together and their personalities fun wise are so similar I have no doubt they are missing out not being able to do this!

Good ol' hayley - always starts very 'heated' debates!

jx

Breeds evolve wether we happen to like that or not I have my views on all sorts of things but breeding out dog on dog aggression is the only way forward for many breeds to thrive, and I mean that in the nicest way possible.

Stafford Spirit as I stated means so many things to me and means so many different things I wont put them to paper so to speak because they can be mis-interpretated to complete novices to the breed. With comments like what have been stated within this thread the breed cannot move forward from it's 'stereo type' owners should defend their breed to the death, not flog it until it's lost because one day this could happen, we then could not defend and preserve something that has been lost or banned because again of a knee jerk reaction.

Hayley, your dogs may not be KC but they are still Staffords owned and loved by you it's up to you not only to protect your own dogs intrests but the breed that you also profess to love so much

I love my dogs and always will until the day I die as their owner it's up to me to promote their good points along with their bad without having to be so specific, many of us here recognise and appreciate Stafford history because they are a very popular breed to own - but one that could be very easily lost and as we all know it would be very difficult to get it back once its gone, good ethical breeders work more towards preserving the breed and breeding out all the traits you are describing a Stafford should have - if they didn't they wouldnt be good ethical breeders.

this is not a heated debate and im not angry at all
I just dont want to strip the stafford of everything that makes it a stafford

I just wish people would think before taking on a breed and then when it does not suit thier needs they change it

I wont rise to anyone digs, i know im not a bad owner and i just dont want to change my breed and see dog aggression being bred out

I really did used to think that it would be a good thing to do , but after thinking about it why would i take away apart of the breed i love so much

bessie, borris and quinn are very happy dogs and just because htey dont have dogge friends does not make a difference to them or not, do u not think we tend to make our dogs human like? and yet again its for your benefit not the dogs

Hayley WHY don't you want it bred it out?

Would you prefer to see the stafford on the Dangerous Dogs list?

'aggression' is NOT what makes a stafford.

Maybe you should consider living with a dog aggressive stafford for a few days and see if you think the same way then.

A reputable breeder who breeds cause they care about the breed, breeds a litter to better the breed. In my opinion, and its apparent that of many others too, taking away the dog aggression (or at least 'taming' it!) would be a big step forward in the way of positive for the breed.
The stafford would still retain all the traits and charcteristics it allways has done, so what would you miss?
Would you miss the dog aggression? Would you miss something that makes your dog a potential danger?
Im a tad confused by your post TBH:?

Whoopsie! Posted at the same time!

If i want a dog who was great with other animals then i would get a breed that is good with other dogs
But i wouldnt take a collie and then change its hearding instincts because that is wrong!

Cant u see if u strip the stafford anymore than it has been already there will no longer be a staffordshire bull terrier not a true one

There is much more than dog aggression that makes the stafford what it is, infact i disagree that dog aggression does make a stafford what it is, IMO anyone who thinks that dog aggression is a quality of the breed is nothing more than a 'hard' wannabe who wants the dog to just say they have a stafford!
Part of the breed standard for the Stafford.
Characteristics: Traditionally of indomitable courage and tenacity. Highly intelligent and affectionate, especially with children.
Temperament: Bold, fearless and totally reliable
Where does it say anything about dog aggression?
When at a show is it usual/acceptable to see staffords in the ring trying to kill each other?-Personally, i don't think so!
I can't understand why someone who loves the breed would wish them to keep such a trait that has the potential to destroy the stafford as a breed!

This is nonsense.

Hayley, who says it will no longer be a Staff? Do you know anything at all about genetics or pyschology?

Removing one charcteristic will not change the rest of the dog. It will be pretty much the same but without the aggression.

I am really beginning to worry about you - why wouldn't a pet owner not want a dog that is good with other animals/dogs? :?