Dalmatian breeding - Overview! Discussions

Jules,

You have totally underestimated me! I can see you are as passionate as I am in showing people that dalmatians, can be trained and are very good at it.

That is why my 12 year old rescue dal has learnt several new tricks and changed completely in the 10 months I've had him.
It's also why my youngest is trained in ringcraft, agility and obedience and is my personal assistance dog.

Surely you are not denying that dallies have a reputation for being 'mad loonies'??

People are constantly surprised by my two as they claim never to have met 'an intelligent dalmatian' or one that behaves. In my opinion, it is their intelligence that is their downfall with so many people.

I have to add that people advised me against the breed that I had loved for many years when I chose to actually get one because of me having a disability, but my dogs are perfect for me.

Oh and btw, you know me from the BDC Forum, my bitch is Tafuta Oh So Quiet

Edit to add: I love watching my 'mad loonies' bolt around the park and fields enjoying themselves, I love the way they are, they get it all out of their system on walks and are lovely quiet dogs in the house. Personally, their way of tearing around like 'mad loonies' shows their enthusiasm for life and I love it!

Okay let you off

But they shouldnt be mad loons ( in general i mean) - there are farr too many that are - and not by choice but from lack of training, understanding and temprement :-(

Jules xxx

I do understand what you mean. T was a nightmare as a pup (so many times I posted on here saying I couldn't wait for her to grow up!) in hindsight, I did do a lot right with her, but I'll do a lot better with my next pup - I guess we're always learning.

I went to a dally breeder and handler and asked what on Earth to do with her, she was only young, couldn't go on long walks and couldn't focus long enough to train much and she used to run up one wall, then across the room, up the sofa and up the wall, and back again etc etc. despite playing with her regularly.
That breeder told me that all 4 of her's do it she also told me that they run up the garden, back into the house and up the wall and then back up the garden.
My first thought was, the door's left open.

She also informed me that if I 'wanted a dog to lay by the fire...' I 'got the wrong breed'.
There is nothing T loves more than lying by the fire and as I speak she has crawled up behind me in the armchair and is fast asleep curled around my back

However, when I breed my litter I will be very wary of who I home my pups to, because dalmatians, moreso than many breeds, in my opinion, need more understanding of how 'they work'.
I suppose my point is, they are very easy to train when you know how

Hi there

I feel a little dissapointed with this quote, especially the first line I highlighted in bold.

could i ask how you would feel if you suddenly found yours to be UNI, I imagine you would not feel any different towards your dog. please don't make it sound like the most devastating thing that could happen.

we knew our dal was uni deaf from the begining and there was no problem having her at all. a dogs hearing is amazing, even being deaf in one ear will still be far stronger than our own hearing, as for training recall there has been no difference at all from training a full hearing dal to a uni hearing (we have both), the wind issue can effect any dog ( infact humans too ) if the wind is blowing even we can have difficulty hearing. the only time she goes completely deaf is when she is chasing a rabbit, but then so does our other dal who has full hearing.!!

I'm sure there will be other that have had problem with uni hearing dogs, but there are always two sides.

we have shown our dog and she does agility, we are even looking in to road dog training. the only thing our dog will never be able to is breed, but then it was never a plan anyway so the deafness was not even thought twice about. I bet if you took both of my dogs out together you would never be able to tell which of them in uni deaf.

I can fully understand all the breeding/KC registering/puppy farm and health points raised within these points and totally agree but just felt a little upset that you felt a uni deaf dal was a big cause for dissapointment.

all the best

Hi
Can i just add - a uni dog (apart from the breeding aspect) is totally acceptable !!!
& i agree unless very skilled you would generally be hard pressed to tell.
In the past many many a uniateral dog Was used for breeding, and have no doubt produced many of the fine dogs we have today !
Now the understanding is that the more we cut out the deafness altogether the better the hearing results are - i am not sure how true this is - or what research has actually been written down to prove such theories.
As with patches new research comes along and things change !
We can only Try and do what we think will be best for the breed

Kind Regards
Jules xxx
Ps i dont know if the poster knew she was Uni - i didnt, i think she was just trying to make a point about tests and their uses

Lottie,
I try and make sure i stay in contact as much as possible with our pups - not only to see them grow and check they are okay, but to help out as soon as i can with any problem.

It is very very hard to get good homes - especially with a big litter.
We had numerous people who waited a year or more for puppies .... then went elsewhere a week before they were born !!!!!!
I can tell you a hundred rediculous enquiries we had !
You have to be prepared for them to be with you till they all find the individual perfect home for them ! You have to find people who trust you to pick the right pup for them - not them picking the cute one ! It may be totally wrong for them

It doesnt take much for a simply solved problem to get out of control.
If you Know your new families will contact you for advice streight away its always better - otherwise they could get out of their depth and send the pup back ! :-(
Or worse give it to someone else and you not know where or how it is !

My most georgeous lad in temprement, construction and apart from having a patch looks too was here till he was five months !!!!

Its hard work

Try and get people to see your adults first - noone realises how Fast they arent little puppies !!!!!
Once someone sees a cute puppy they are in love - no matter how wrong it or they might be for each other ! Make sure all questions and answers are done Before seeing pups


Never Ever think it is too late to say no !!!
They are your babies, your responsibility and Always will be !

People say whatever they think you want to hear! trust me - as soon as you have a doubt say no !

I decided next time i will give out our puppy advice packs sooner ! - They have all our horry stories in about what dals can be like if left to their own devices, and all their good points aswell ;-) We gave them when the families picked up their puppies, but i think if they have tim eto read through before and do some reseach further into what they are advised that could deter anyone not 100% committed too

Anyway just a little advice for when your pups are planned !
( do u have a date in mind yet or is it wayyy in the future ? )

Jules xxxx

Hi Jules

There are quite compelling data to support the elimination of unis and bis from breeding. Research by Strain & Telford (1996) found matings of normal x normal hearing produced 72.8% normal hearing progeny whilst affected x affected (uni or bi) produced 58.4% normal hearing progeny. Not a huge difference, especially considering this is using affected x affected, but this was over a large sample base of 4596 progeny.

Ref: http://www.steynmere.com/DALM_DEAFNESS2.html

But cutting out affecteds from breeding isn't really going to help the problem to any great degree. Whilst Dalmatian breeding is trying to preserve the pigment in the inner ear and eye area by eliminating deafness and blue eye (in UK) from breeding, it is at the same time, reducing pigment by eliminating patching. The surface area of the inner ear, where the pigment is so vital for the hearing mechanism, is a continuation of the skin on the outer surface. To select for reduced pigment on the outer skin also reduces the chances of pigment in the inner ear.

Another problem is that the placement of melanocytes (pigment cells) is through a migration process that isn't entirely under genetic control. A phenomenon known as 'developmental noise,' which is described as, random events at a molecular level, accounts for some variations in the distribution of pigment and is entirely random.

Hiya
I suppose in the past breeders had to, and did, take risks and deal with consequences. Specially during the war etc
A lot would be frouned upon nowadays so not even tried
Jules xxx

Don't suppose they had BAER testing back then. When was it first available for dogs?

hi .. im new to the site but on reading this felt i have 2 put in my 2 pennies worth..
At the moment i have an irish wolf hound and a dalmation, ellie is the dally she is my third rescue dally and i had her at 6 mths old. The vet called the rescue centre and said if someone didnt collect her by 5pm that day he would follow the owners request to put her down... we drove over 200 miles and got there with 10 mins to spare.
She was to be put down simply because she is totally deaf and the owner couldnt handle her.... she is now 6 yrs old and mainly trained 2 signs but also trained to copy the other dogs we have owned! I was told a deaf dally was imposible to train but she is a hun... the only problem we ever had was the fact she doesnt speak 'dog' and so has problems understanding strange dogs.
She wasnt hard to train, she NEVER snaps when woken suddenly and keeps our much larger pup on his toes. Ellie has both eyes brown and our blue eyed resue had no hearing problems.... and as we all know alot of problem dogs aren't problem dogs at all ... its badly trained owner!!
sorry for rambling!!

Jules,
Thank you for all your advice There's only so much you can learn through books before you need real experiences!

Cannon - I would not feel any different about either of my dogs as you well know ;-)
My question wasn't 'how would you feel about your dog if you found it to be uni?' I wouldn't love them any less. However, I would feel awful if I approached a uni dog on the wrong side unwittingly and ended up upsetting the dog or worse, upsetting our relationship.

I'm sure you've no had any problems with your uni dog but I have been told by several people that you need to be aware what side a uni dog is deaf on. Ok, so I have no experience but certain dogs would possibly have a different reaction to being unable to hear you very well on one side than other dogs.

I hope that clarifies it a little.

Don't worry about challenging this post though - I'm a little fed up of justifying myself recently so have decided to take a break from here :smt001

It's a long story but I have a rescued deaf Dal with very good recall. She goes off lead on walks with my other dog and either watches her or me. She stays quite close and soon follows when I change direction. My other dog is a Belgian Shepherd so she's good at keeping an eye on her. People only know that my dal is deaf if I tell them as she is so tuned in to me and is always glancing at me and picks up the most subtle signals. Some people even don't believe me when I tell them she's deaf. I'm not saying she has been easy to train, just not as hard as you might think but with lots of patience and dedication it has been worth it. And she doesn't snap when startled. Just jumps, then gives kisses!

youv asked my questions for me,

just want to say i too have a dalmatian who is deaf in one ear, i also have one with perfect hearing, i too could not be sure without checking the hearing test sheet which ear she is deaf in, no one would know she was deaf in one ear, sometimes i swear she hears better than her mum, she can hear a paper bag crackle from the bottom of the garden and when i blow my dog whistle she reacts quicker than mum.