I like quite a few of the HPR breeds, but after reading a few threads about them being 'difficult' I just wondered if my circumstances would suit one * Whether you have had dogs previously I've owned dogs for 14 years (still have my first dog, a 15yr old Border Collie), also had a Bearded Collie X, and a Retriever x. Currently have a working bred English Springer Spaniel and a Dalmatian. * Your circumstances - do you work etc? I currently work from home and fully intent on doing so for a while yet, although a part time job might be on the cards. * How much time you have for exercise I currently walk my Dalmatian and Spaniel for anywhere from 1 hour to 6 hours depending on what I am doing and how I feel. I currently have 14 acres of private fields and about 3 acres of woodland to walk them on, as well as a 400 acre country type park next to my house. * Whether you have children, other pets etc I have 6 horses and 3 dogs currently, a raised pond with some fish and a fish tank inside. Looking into getting chickens but they will be securely away from the dogs. * What characteristics you are looking for I want a dog who is always up for a walk and can accompany me with the horses as well as on long walks and not over heat too much. I like to train for 'tricks' in the house and basic obedience, they don't need to be robotic but an intelligent dog that likes a job to do is ok by me. * What breeds you have already looked at and your thoughts on them I like Large Munsterlanders, Vizslas, Wire haired Vizslas, German Shortpaired Pointers, German Wirehaired Pointers, German Longhaired Pointers, Brittanys and Slovaks, so most of them * Anything else you think might be relevant or important I am trying to move to a smallholding where the dogs would be outside quite a lot during the day whilst I am dealing with the horses. I have just started teaching my Dally to track and I am probably enjoying it more than he is. I am also interested in doing some basic gundog work, not competitive but for fun.
If you want a HPR breed, then go for it, you have an active life already with active dogs, cant see why a HPR breed would be any different for you. We seem to be seeing a trend recently viewed by a few that only a certain type of person is capable of owning a HPR breed, this is not true and as this forum can vouch.... we have many HPR breeds in all types of homes, and they all thrive. An active breed is an active breed, and as long as you are prepared for it, then thats all that counts. Personally my feeling are if you can cope with a SS , then you are well equipped to cope with any other breed Yes some are more independent that other s, but thousands of owners seem to cope with their traits, so if you want one and feel you are able to give one a fulfilling life , then go for it. I know of many HPR breeds in normal everyday family homes, and their owners cope only to well. What ever breed you decide on, I am sure you will be extremely happy...after all you have a Springer Spaniel and a Dalmatian anything else will be a dream
An active breed is not actually the same as all other active breeds. One of the reasons so many HPRs find their way into rescue is that owners cannot cope with the hunting. Dalmatians and Boxers and Dobermanns do not hunt, so thinking that an HPR is exactly the same is incorrect. And of course some HPRS have had the hunting bred out of them (I know many who can barely make it to their food bowl). Just as there are Boxers who are shy When those of us who man Discover Dogs, or who home check and assess dogs for rescue, we like to give the whole picture to people so that they are fully aware of traits which may be more difficult for them to handle. Just as ANY responsible breeder or owner would do, eg as we have seen recently on the thread re letting sled dogs off the lead. etc etc Those of us who own HPRs who ARE strong hunting dogs speak from first hand experience with our OWN dogs and those of others with whom we meet, train etc etc. That is what forums are for, to discuss and learn from the experiences of others; so when someone asks would an (insert relevant breed) suit me, those of us who have had the relevant breed for a couple of decades or more will try to help.....................
You are incorrect in assuming I am incorrect in my understanding of the difference traits in different breeds. My comment about the Springer Spaniel and a Dalmatian was said in humor, you must have missed that. This forum is exceptionable in helping people choose new breeds, but there is a fine line between pointing out the unsuitability of a breed to an owner and an a attitude that seems to suggest , unless you have owned a breed for decades and have ALL the experience of HPR breeds then you are not suitable. BTW, you aint met many Boxers if you think they dont have a hunting instict
You sound like a fantastic potential HPR owner. I haven't owned any other HPR's other than Sika (HWV) but I know she'd fit right into your lifestyle and home
I'm drawn to GSP's, I've met a few and they have all been considerably calmer than my Dally I saw a few HWV's at a game fair and they caught my eye. I did a lot of research on Brittany's but the one I met put me off slightly as she seemed smaller and more petite than I thought they were supposed to be and she was quite aggressive to both people and dogs :? Munsters sound fabulous, but I have found the short coat of my Dally soo easy.
I think as long as you understand what each breed is bred for and feel you can cope with any behaviours that might crop up as a result then you'll be fine - same as any other breed basically. The most important thing about choosing a breed is always ensuring you've done in-depth research IMO. HWV would be a good starting point as they're more sensitive than most HPRs which makes them easier to train/control. Each dog is an individual, however. My friend has a Spinone and he has been serious hard work. Most people say that Spins don't have a lot of hunting instinct which for the most part may be true, but this dog (in novice hands) would've been seriously out of control and most likely rehomed once into adolescence! He's now a lovely dog, but she has put in hundreds if not thousands of hours into his Gundog training to get him like this.
How does the way HPR's hunting differ from that of a Dalmatian then? My Dalmatian points and chases birds/rabbits, and has caught quite a few on his own (although he doesn't bring them back, he eats them) I've looked on the net but can't find a definitive answer, when walking a HPR breed are they likely to run away into the bushes and not come back? Will they flush game out? Will they not listen to recall commands when they find a smell? I'm still wondering how exactly they are 'difficult'? :?
I am not an expert, but I am not sure if the majority of HPR's are "difficult". All dogs within each breed are different and some need more skill and effort than others to make the best of them. I have a female friend with a weimeraner (dog) and a vizla (bitch). They are primarily companion dogs living within a family and are both quite young - high energy they certainly are, but they are both fine dogs with no problems. Another friend has kept and bred GSP's for years (again in a family environment). Her latest 10 month old, apart from being over friendly towards other dogs - wanting to play all the time, which makes her not too reliable on her recall at the moment, is also turning into a fine dog. If you have the space, time and are prepared to train according to individual need, I would think your situation would be excellent. I do think that these sort of dogs are essentially "country" dogs and need to have the space to make things easier for their owners and happier for the dogs.
I have a Springer and a GSP and I would say the GSP has definitely been more challenging than the Springer. The GSP has a phenomenal work drive, he never voluntarily switches off. I have redirected all his hunting and working instincts onto toys which means he can not relax until all the toys are put away and he has no access to the log pile in the garden. Then he will chill out. The GSP is also much more intelligent and if not kept focused on work/toy related activities when we were out walking, used to go and generate recall opportunities to get the ball out of my pocket. By this I mean he would start being naughty by rounding up strangers, just so I will call him back. This was stopped by me anticipating the problem and never rewarding this behaviour with the ball when he came back. If I won't interact with him and don't keep him close to me he will take a stick up to a complete stranger to get them to play with him. Unfortunately they nearly always will, which makes this worse. Generally he stalks me, waiting for me to do something with the ball. I encourage this by playing with him on and off all the time, because I like to have him right with me, where I can see him all the time. It was very noticeable that when I tried to go jogging with him, so could not play with him, he was going self employed and disappearing for longer and longer periods. Which is exactly what you DON'T want. No jogging with him now. I have seen a lot of GSPs in rescue because they have dodgy recall and have killed sheep. This is what happens when they go into pet homes, the time is not put in and they are allowed to develop their hunting instincts. He has been very easy to train, provided he can see the point of what you are asking. If not, it is like wading through treacle. I gave up with pure obedience classes as he was bored stiff and lay down asleep most of the time. So... they are beautiful, rewarding, easy dogs, provided you put in the time and spend time doing things that they feel are relevant. If not they are best avoided as they can be very "difficult".
I think another consideration would be the progression of the breeds you stated interested you and whether they are still primarily a working dog or whether they've been diluted by wins in the showring. There are lots of people who breed GSP's for example who have no interest in working them, they are all about the CC's and so this line may be more manageable than, say, a Swifthouse dog. From what i've read, Munsterlanders are very keen hunters and hard workers, as are Brittany's. So, even within the subgroup, there are breeds which are easier than others, and lines which may be more suitable for a none shooting home. But generally, I would say your lifestyle is great for a HPR.
My answer from your other thread: I would say it is a mixture of being very intelligent, independent, very high energy and very 'worky'. A lot of the retrievers, spaniels, setters, etc., working instincts have been considerably dumbed down due to generations of breeding strictly for pets. Most of the HPR's don't have anywhere near the level of popularity of many of the retrievers and spaniels, nor are they generally pushed on the pet market as much. They therefore tend to remain more true to their working roots. They think on their own two feet (unlike your Labs, Goldens, etc., who are very handler dependent and hang on your every word!) and think their way is best. Oh, and did I mention how smart they are? all these combinations can make for a challenging dog who will test your patience. Obviously there are differences between each HPR breed the same as any another, with some some being more biddable, some being more sensitive, etc.
Just a note, having a hunting INSTINCT is not the same as having hunting as your SOLE reason for existence which nothing else can touch!
They think on their own two feet (unlike your Labs, Goldens, etc., who are very handler dependent and hang on your every word!) and think their way is best. Oh, and did I mention how smart they are? all these combinations can make for a challenging dog who will test your patience. I'll 2nd that. Especially the try your patience bit.
It sounds to me like you'd be the perfect home for a rescue HPR (or pointer)who is unfairly doing time for the crime of being too energetic.
Your home and lifestyle - as well as your commitment to your dogs - sounds perfect for any active breed. I like many of the HPR group too - especially the GSP and GWP. I think you have had some really excellent and relevant advice, especially regarding checking what your dog was specifically bred to do and looking into how "worky" certain lines are. My sister has had Spinoni for the past 25 years and some have certainly had more hunting drive than others. A couple of her males have been really hard work because their hunting obsession has taken over when out in the countryside, making their recall practically non-existent. However, these same dogs have made very laid back, easy going companion dogs away from tempting game and wildlife.
