Dalmatian - Some questions on breeding Health

Hi,
I am not really sure where to put this post? but i was wondering if any Dal owners could help me out?.

We are thinking about breeding our dal lila as i friend of ours has a stunning male and they are wanting to have him mated with before he gets the chop but the he is brown spotted and ours is black , would that make any problems ? Would you get a mixure of both coloured pups or do you only breed black to black and brown to brown?.

Another question i have is my lila has a blue eye and he has 2 blue eys , would that mean all pups would end up with 1 or 2 blue eyes or does it not make a differance what the parents eye colour is?.

Thanks Janine x

Firstly the KC recommeds that Dals are both hip scored and BAER hearing tested before breeding, it is therefore essential that these tests are done before breeding.

Secondly it is ok to mate a Liver spot to a Black spot (I'm no Dal expert though!), however I'm concerned about your motives for breeding.

Personally I believe the only good reason to breed is to better the existing line of your chosen breed, ie to better the breed.

I think that breeding just becasue you can is a very bad thing and will only add to the already full rescue centres and breed rescues, especially if the parents aren't hearing tested and all the pups turn out to be deaf! :-(

Do you show/work your Dal? That IMO is the only way to tell if a dog is worth breeding from, if your bitch is only a pet I think it'd probably be best if you kept it that way and had her spayed to be honest.

Also I think to let a male dog mate and then be castrated is far worse than just castrating in the first place. The dog will be allowed to know what that feeling is like and then denied the feeling ever again. He won't miss what he's never had, if you get what I mean! ;-)

However, if both you and the sire owner have done all the recommended health tests and have checked both of the dogs pedigrees for compatibility then please accept my apologies and I wish you well with your pups.

Hi,
Thank you for your post.

I'm unsure about what to do , my family/the male dogs owners are all happy with go but am worried mostly for her as shes my whole world and i would die if something ever happened to her - if i know she would have the babies with 100% no problems but i know things can always go wrong like with people.

If we did decided to go ahead , we would have all relevent tests etc done and even if pups where born with problems/deaf and couldnt be sold , we would just keep them - even if it was the whole litter!.

Would cost loadssss to feed lol ,probley end up working 3jobs but we wouldnt send them to a rescue - we live on a farm and have sooo much room and do seem to be collecting dogs as it is - nobody would notice a few more !.

Joking apart i wouldn't go into this without thinking it out so thank you for your post.

Did you happen to know anything regarding blue eyes?.
Janine x

Hi,
I'm glad to hear you are thinking it through properly,but breeding shouldn't be undertaken lightly.
I don't know an awful lot about Dals,here is a link that Amie posted,
http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/breeding/breeder2.html

If both dogs have blue eyes then neither of them are breed standard. The Dalmatian breed standard states that in black spots the eyes should be dark and in liver spots should be amber.
Blue eyes can be a sign of deafness also.
If I were you, on that basis alone I wouldn't breed with the dogs you have.
Becky

Hi janie

It's perfectly ok to breed black to brown. Black is the dominant colour, so you will only get brown spotted pups if your bitch carries brown. If she has a brown parent she will definitely carry. If there are other browns in her relatives, she may carry, but you can't be certain without DNA testing.

The genetics of eye colour is not quite so well understood but generally brown eye is dominant over blue. And in the Dalmatian it's most likely due to lack of pigment associated with the coat colour. You would probably get a mixture of eye colour in the litter.

You should be aware though of the risk of deafness associated with pigment. Because the Dalmatian is a breed of the colour known as extreme white, there is a high risk of deafness and the presence of blue eye increases this risk.

Breeding your bitch to a dog with brown eyes will reduce the risk of deafness in the puppies.

Don't know if you're in the UK, and I'm no expert in the breed, but I do believe blue eye is considered a fault in this country, but not USA.

I can only echo what others have already said.

I know nothing about Dalmatians, so can't help with any specific questions about the breed. However, I would urge you to reconsider breeding.

Why do you want to breed?

Hi,
Nothing has been decided , i don't think am wanting to breed her anyway (as said above) but i just wanted to get some facts on it all before i took it any furthur - at least now i can tell the people we couldnt breed them ( due to eyes).

Thanks for help
Janine

i don't know anything about dallies so can't comment it might be a good idea to speak to your local breed club they would have alot of knowledge about all aspects of breeding

best wishes

Hi Janine
You don't say whether Lila and your friends dogs are KC registered or not. If they are then any responsible breeder would have put endorsements on them, especially if they have been sold as pets. You need to look at both lines of dogs to see if there are any problems healthwise along with getting the relevant checks done.
Bear in mind every time you breed from a bitch you are taking a chance. Alot of bitches are lost due to whelping in experienced hands.
You say in a previous post, you recognise her faults and you wanted her to come to you rather than her going somewhere and being used for breeding. http://www.dogsey.com/showthread.php?t=32250
I don't mean any disrespect at all, but If she was good enough to breed on from the breeders would have kept her when she was returned to them at nine months. They didn't, they sold her on as a pet.
Personally I don't see what the point is of breeding your dog. I don't think for one second that your motive is money, sounds more like your friend had an idea and you're thinking it over. This alone is the wrong reason. The Dalmation rescue already struggle with finding homes for Dalmations, please do not add to the uneccesary numbers. There are already too many things that can go wrong with this breed. Also tell your friend that allowing his dog to mate the once, can change the dogs character. What is the point of using him?
You said in a previous post you finally managed to persuade your family to have one, how would they feel keeping about keeping a litter of deaf pups if it all goes wrong. Great sentiment but on a farm it would be dangerous.
Please have Lila for what you got her for. A family pet, one that you adore. Tell your friend to be responsible and get the dog castrated and leave the breeding of dallies to those that have the expertise to do so. I hope i'm not appearing hard, I just can't emphasise enough what a big mistake you would be making.

Hi there, forgive my if I'm wrong but isnt she a rescue dal?

Janine... isn't Lila a rescue?

Blue eyes shouldn't be bred from as it's not breed standard. It's fine to breed black with brown (Takara's dad is liver, mum is black) but I'm sure I remember you saying she was a rescue...

Hi,
No she isn't a rescue lol , she was taken back to the breeders as owners split up - i went to buy a puppy but ended up with her instead.

Please DO NOT breed from a bitch with a blue eye, it is completely against the British Dalmatian Club ethical code on breeding, it increases the chances of totally deaf puppies which we as a breed are trying to minimise if not eradicate altogether.
And PLEASE ..... the breed is DalmatiAn.
But - having ranted slightly - well done for asking first and finding out a bit more about it, wish there were more like you!

While we are on the top of breeding/ deaf pups ( not wanting to turn this into worldwar 3!) but the place i got lila from said the reason that so many pups have ended up deaf is do to people over breeding dals ( e.g to get show stock) as their seems pretty much 2 types of dals now ( looks wise) - does anyone agree with this or heard anything of it?.

Alot of her dogs/bitchs had blue eyes ( not kennel club reg) but she has had no problem with deaf puppies ever - she said its all due to finding the right stock where as others are breeding for a certain look/build that is where the problems have come ...

Deccy - is their a website anywhere ( lincolnshire area) that has dals that need re-homing?.
I have searched ( and did before i got lila) but haven't been able to find a dal rescue in my area?.
Thanks

I'll PM you in a minute ;-)

Does she have BAER hearing certificates to prove it??? (I doubt it!) Sounds like a load of ...... rubbish!
"Show" breeders breed to the standard, have a read of it, blue eyes are a serious fault in the UK breed Standard.
I suppose there are two "types" - good ones that are close to the standard, and those which are not!!!! And they both arrive in the same litter sometimes!!

Well i love my lila no matter what - even if she does have a dodge blue eye!

Do you know anything about fostering dal's? Does this mean you look after them until they are rehomed?.