Cross breeding Controversial

Just ponderings fomr other threads - it seems a given that anyone who breeds a cross is unethical?

Why would this be?

I am wondering if it is a showing thing? Or a 'breedist' thing?

I would personally not cross breed, but I cannot see how crossbreeding automatically makes a breeder unethical?

If all the relevent tests have been done and the homes vetted? the breeder is willing to give lifetime support etc?

Why is is so frowned upon?

Is it not the type of dogs being bred..
On the one hand you have the small breed crosses all chi's oddles and jrt's ...Then the bandog types taking neo's or corso's and crossing them for what ever reason ...

Is it not breeding for gain ...
Am I making sense ...?lol

As far as i can tell its because they dont fit a standard. We get a lot of "what the hell is that" comments and people over to tell us how awful our do is. Makes for a fun day out at the shows

Also the names get a lot of scrutiny. But you try call them a cocker poodle cross and you get met with the disgusted look and "ahh a cockerpoo"

And what some people charge for them. but then on other thread the same value of money is defended in a ped. A well bred crossbreed is going to cost just the same, surely?

You get a lot of if you want a crossbreed get a rescue, but i feel the same can be said for any dog. Its up to people what they spend their money on.

I see it the way you have put above, i would only get a pup that has been health tested, health tested parents, homes vetted, willing to answer my millions of questions openly and honestly and give a life long puppy contract/support. thats whether ped or cross. Then do as much research i can on the breeder. Obv not for rescues i just chose a dog i believe i can bring out the true potential of with rescues.

Do agree though, the extent of crossbreeding is just insane. It does seem as though they will try any cross to see if it takes (bad breeders)

I think most breeders of crossbreeds are unethical coz they arent setting out to achieve anything. IMO an ethical pedigree breeder is one who breeds to further the breed and breed to produce the best dogs they possible can... how can a crossbreed further the breed? these dogs are all different, and have no breed standard. if people want to breed a specific mix to produce a certain type of dog, then a breeding plan should be set up and years spent on it... the vast majority of crossbreed breeders do not do this, they just do it coz these crossbreeds (such as the poo's) are popular just now... i do not agree with that.

JMO.

I was one of the people that stated its unethical. I dont expect people to agree but Il explain why cross breeders are un ethicals even those that health test, in my eyes.

First thing health testing alone doesnt make any breeders ethical pedigree or not, I know breeders that test that are far from ethical and yes they breed pedigree show dogs.

In my eyes when you are breeding you should be breeding to better something, You should have an aim, the pups go out working, in the ring or what ever. You are not producing pups for the sake of it, you spend time choosing two dogs that compliment each other so that the pups will hopefully be better and go far in that area. How can you choose two dogs to compliment each other if they are not of the same structure, tempermant and the like? You cant you just stick two dogs together.

Any ETHICAL breeder will be passionate about their breed, so why the hell would they want to breed to produce cross breeds that are going to be something or nothing like the orginal breeds?

People spend a great amount of time researching their breed, their history, breed traits, lines to go with, lines to avoid, lines with health issues, lines clear from health issues yada yada. How many cross breeders do that for both the breeds their cross breeding?

Of course any cross breeding that is done to benefit a breed I would support 100%.

I dont see the point in people breeding dogs that, are not bred for a purpose. They will never become registered and alot are based around lie after lie. Traits and charactics are un-known, so most are made up by breeders if its the truth or not. Thats no good for a family looking for their next pet, because alot of the dogs turn out nothing like expected.

I doubt one person could give me a vaild reason as to what the benefits are of cross breeds, apart from they make great family pets..well so do pedigrees.

Anyway dont think its just cross breeding I dont agree with, I dont agree with any breeding done for self gain, or no purpose...and yes that does include pet breeders breeding pedigrees!

Other than being a good pet?

It also goes to ask - why continue to breed dogs if they are no longer used for that 'Job' how can you further a breed that has no purpose??

Gosh - feeling very deep today.

Hmm....I am with you on the last point - but I do not see why this has come to mean that cross breeding is wrong. Purpose is an odd thing....why is it worse breeding for pet homes than breeding for showing, or working?

Again...I will say I am out to advocate crossbreeding I just wondered why so many were SO anti.

See i would have no problem rescuing a crossbreed but i am not sure I would buy one ...

I guess this is partly where I get confused....the dogs are the same whether you get them from a breeder or a rescue...IF it is an ethical breeder why not? They tend to make just as good pets!

Partly this got me thinking after reading on a differnt thread...and partly it was a lady I have in my class who has a 'Puggle'.....and intends to breed.....I instantly said my peice about how I did not think that was the best idea.....but she is going to have all the tests she can done, as is the owner of the sire - and she is quite willing to not breed if anything is discovered...she has 3 homes lined up already (for 2 years time) and they are all friends who she is not going to charge for the pups......

I implored her to go and look at rescue siute before she finally came to a desision....but why is she so wrong? Se loves this dog and it will have a home for life no matter what....she did not get it to breed from, but would like to.

Posting and dashing because the fire needs stoking and it's too cold to let it go out

I'd say in basic terms, it's the intent of the person breeding, why do they intend to breed? If it's just to sell puppies and generate a cash flow from your dogs, whether they're pedigree or not, then that's unethical. The vast majority of people who breed cross breeds, to me, fit into this category, there isn't any other reason to breed even to produce nice pets, when there are thousands of nice pets waiting for homes in rescue, even young pups and dogs. Many pedigree breeders also fall into the unethical bracket, and some are even in a bit of a grey area, they do produce litters where they don't keep a pup back, but their breeding scheme overall, is of great benefit, producing nice dogs to add to the gene pool, if that makes sense?

Right, off to go stoke the fire and finish off work for the day!

I think its a common problem across the board, there are just too many dogs being bred full stop. 9 times out of 10 dogs are going to be pets and not used for the purpose the breed were originally bred. Its funny ive never had a bad comment about my terrier cross being a "designer cross" when out and about we just get asked about her since no one has seen a solid JRT. But with our poodle cross we get people who sadly go out their way.

If I am being honest if I know of a frenchie cross at a realistic price who i could prove had healthy and tested parents would i be able to say no . doubt it ... so I was wrong in my previous post i would buy a crossbreed ..

There are very few out there who have breeding plans but they are out there. Thats why whenever i speak to someone considering them to go out and search for them. A shame you have to trawl through so many who are just breeding for the hell of it.

I dont for one second think that for some people producing pets, and show dogs is any different.. But for me it is. I would never have a litter with out generally believing the pups would be better than the parents and do well in the area selected. There are plenty pets out their, and to produce litters of 6/7 pups to supply the pet market is just not something agree with.

Surely someone passionate about their breed wouldnt cross breed to get a dog better to live with? Cant be that passionate if thats the case.

I also know of pedigree breeders that do no research properly, that ill imform new owners and the like.

Your right alot of pedigree dogs now do not have a purpose, but my point is they were bred many years ago for a reason. Times have changed, and many dogs are not needed any more, I understand that. Although it is nice to see breed continue to do what they were bred for.

Nope I do not feel that producing pups as good pets is a good enough reason to breed. Of course all dogs should be good pets, but that should not be the sole reason for breeding imo.

For many people cross breeding isnt wrong, but for me it is! I cant and wont understand it. I cant and wont agree with it.

I to would rescue a cross but not buy from a breeder, because to buy from a breeder you would be supporting them, and as I dont agree with cross breeding I wouldnt want to support them.

Tass can i ask what Zeff's breeder wanted out of his cross ?
Please dont start a wolfdog debate everyone .. i am just curious what the difference between a pure CsV and Saarloos would have made ....

Why can;t people just be passionate about dogs? Why does it have to be a breed thing?

(it was Lozzibears answer on the other thread that got me thinking....just remembered!)

God knows....never asked....seems a very silly cross to me as (although both started out the same) they have become very different temp wise.

The last contact I had was an email I sent that was not replied to - asking more about the operattion he'd had before he came to me.....

Btw if you google'' CsV and Saarloos'' see what you get ...

Of course you can just be passionate about dogs, I would expect most people to be passionate about dogs overall like I am and I would guess you to.
But when breeding you, you are breeding because you are passionate about the breed and feel you have something to offer. Im passionate about all dogs, but have never been as passionate about any breed as the Chinese Cresteds and thats why I am involved in showing and breeding them, and not another breed. (other than the fact that it happens its the breed me mum shows and breeds)