"Irish" staffords - should they have a change of name? Discussions

Should we start calling them something else?
If so what should they be called?

i think Old Tyme Staffs would lessen the confusion. maybe?
i dont like the idea of putting something like 'sporting' in there cos some stupid people might get the wrong idea

stupid people ususally get the wrong idea anyway, regardless of the name

old tyme stafford that have their own guidelines to size & weight and people actually stick to it

I agree with the old tyme but not the guidelines, once something is set in stone (or on paper :? ) it can only be a bad thing for the breed JMHO.

I used to advertise pups as old tyme and a lot of people though that meant short + stocky so I had to go back to advertising them as "irish" so people knew what I meant

I still think Scottish bull terrier sounds great !!
(just kidding!! )

but then you still have the problems of any dog with an ounce of SBT blood being called a SBT or OTS :?

if your talkin old time then i think they should be called bull and terrier with no standard as they were ,as everyone already knows the type joe mallen and group got kc registration for is what we know as the staffordshire bull terrier and has a standard.just my opinion

i notice 2 people have voted for the suggest alternative name option, just wondering what your alternative names are

bull & terrier

To me the "irish"stafford is just a stafford bred from differnt lines than a kc dog..still a stafford different lies....cheers

Hello I think I will join this debate;

I think they should just be called Irish Staffs and I agree with Weightwatcher (Hello :smt039 by the way I don't think I've bumped into you before)
That Irish staffs (old tyme whatever) but the type Laura has are staffords but from a different view point. I think lots can be learnt from each other by kc and non kc stafford owners.
I mean I've been to one weight pulling show (conformation show) and thought all the dogs there were extremely happy all tails wagging etc and ready to go - now no disrespect meant here (as I show myself) but I don't think I see the same proportion of dogs at KC shows so happy.
However both groups of people are commited to their dogs. No question.
I think the "conformation shows" have the atmosphere of Staffs from days of old - yet they almost seem to be loosing in some respects the "package look" of the staff I know a fit dog is good dog but appearance does matter otherwise we would all have very very fit poodles.

Temprament is the most important but if we just look at the "middle" ground people in each gropup we may step outside of worlds and views and meet in the middle and just think of the dogs we could achieve then

This is my Sal she is almost 2 in this picture.

right i am tryin to understand and am open minded enough to have someone change my veiws ,but i cant understand why if you have a pedigree dog kc registered called staffordshire bull terrier and then some one breeds it taller and it is no longer kc registered can call it a staffordshire bull terrier of any kind ,although there is only one kind of staffordshire bull terrier the kc type. i would like to know if i breed a boxer form english lines shorter and stockier and never registered it kc and called it an english boxer how many kc boxer owners would take it serious.i hope this dosent come across as a critisism i am genuinley trying to understand.

I too would like to know ?

the reason I asked in an earlier post as to whether Irish owners still like to retain the name Staffordshire is because the majority call the KC staffy a fat unfit lump?
Thats what makes me wonder why they still like to keep the connection with the name ?
I wouldnt think they would still like the connection between the two breeds????

Hi Pete.

Hope young Cody is well?

I will wait for someone more knowledgable than me to answer that.
Although I could give it a go.

hi karren

cody is doin great, not a fat lump who cant travel the length of the ring without fallen over yet (joke) hope your two are fine. please have a go karren at answerin as im after as many veiws as poss.
heres a dog and a bitch from my preferd line of kc dogs and dont think they look like the type they get protrayed by some none kc owners ,



i know they dont say all look like that but they dont say its the minority do either

Good post Kazz I know where you are coming from regarding the differing atmospheres at the various shows. I like Sal & Tess both nice looking animals.

What about having Staffordshire Bull Terriers and Staffordshire Bulldogs since for a lot of the time its difficult to actually ascertain where the terrier is in some of the modern Staffords that is not a dig here again I know there are good & bad examples of both but imo the bad examples are more often than not the show winners which can only be a bad thing as they ARE breed representatives and are the set standard for others which is not good especially if some are known to have breathing problems etc. The terriers referring to the dogs more inline with the old standard and the bulldogs referring to the current standard. Makes sense to me. But I guess when we are calling for a name change for the current dogs it is not seen as acceptable than for when we are asked to change our dog’s name.

At the end of the day I think they are all just Staffords, Pete why should people change the name just because they don’t breed to a standard set by the Kennel Club even if their stock is directly descended from old KC lines or infact from modern registered KC dogs but the breeder just did not carry on with the tradition would it be fair to say that these dogs should be called something different just because they don’t fit the standard even though they share similar lineage as yours or others registered dogs? Would you say the same for dogs that were perhaps 13” tall and unregistered? Does not seem a fair assumption to me personally.

The dogs you posted there are not my cup of tea but I respect that everybody has their own opinions on what looks good and that is yours.

cracking dogs pete who are they ?

emma the two gods are ch knockon dance with the divil and ch knockon harum scarum.
laura i disagree with you that the bad examples are more often the show winners ,and why should they change there name cause they dont breed to standard and are not registered as a pedigree dog with the kc,well i think if you dont want too be part of the pedigree being kc staffordshire bull terrier and dont want the dog to be part of the standard ,why call it the same name .i dont know if its directly that yous dont like the kc standard and its dogs when the name was made up for the kc ,before that they were bull and terriers of all different types and sizes not standardised and not kc registered,i havent heard anythin to make me change my mind on this veiw but if someone came up with a good enough reason maybe i would but for me there is only one type of staffordshire bull terrier the kc type.

I dont have a problem with true staffords being called staffords either reg or non reg but i do have a problem with mixed bloods being called staffords and by that i mean any dog with EBT in it or Wheaten terrier in its history (this is one dog a lot of ISBT owners dont even know was used in some strains too) in fact if any alien blood has been used at all they should not be called staffords because they are crossbreeds

Pete...they are cracking staffys!!! al to me THAT is the condition I like to see on a dog...beautiful!
Minty....you're probably goona get slated for that....but not by me :wink: