What is a 'Pitbull' ? Discussions

I have been looking into the history of Pitbulls, and, ok they were originally bred from a 'mixture' of terriers and bull breed.

This is a bit I have copied and pasted about Pitbulls under the DDA.....which states that a Pitbull is not a breed in itself - but encompasses a range of breeds (terrier x bull)

The Dangerous Dogs Act 1991 is a piece of UK legislation that was introduced in response to various incidents of serious injury or death resulting from attacks by aggressive and uncontrolled dogs, particularly on children. These incidents received heavy tabloid attention, causing widespread public concern over the keeping of dangerous dogs and a resulting legislative response.

Four breeds in particular were identified by the Act:

Pit Bull Terriers (a description which has led to some confusion, as the "Pit bull" is not a breed in and of itself but encompasses a range of breeds)
Tosa
Dogo Argentino
Fila Brasileiro
It was made illegal to own any of these dogs without specific exemption from a court. The dogs have to be muzzled and kept on a lead in public, they must be registered and insured, neutered and receive microchip implants. The Act was also supposed to ban the breeding, sale and exchange of these dogs.

There have been several test cases of the Act, most famously Dempsey (a pit bull terrier) who in 1995 was finally reprieved from a death sentence, to widespread media attention. The definition of the word "type" in the legislation was of particular controversy, as was the lack of discretion that the Act gives magistrates.

In November 2002, The Princess Royal was fined £500 under the Act after one of her Bull Terriers attacked two children.


The worry I have is Georgie is American Bulldog X SBT. I hope he is not classed as 'Pitbull' type :?
What do you guys think?

In my opinion any staffy cross would be classed as pitbull type. To me a pitbull is a large powerful dog with staffy physical characteristics, so that would include Irish Staffs, amstaffs and any american bulldog with staff type heads.
Becky

I agree, this is also a worry for me too, because I own American Bulldogs and a Staffy X..

Nicci, is your staffy crossed with an american bulldog?

So do you guys think my Georgie is classed as a pitbull 'type' dog?

No she's a French Bulldog cross Staff (sort of looks like a Staffy with very short legs and a Bulldog body she has a very odd appearance)

As for Georgie is hard to say because no-one is really going to know how he's going to fair out until he's fully grown all you can and continue saying is he is a Staffordshire Bull Terrier Cross and thats not lying The general 'Joe public' wouldn't even know what a Pitbull looked like so I really wouldn't worry even though with whats been going on I know it's hard not too.

I have a Hines bred AB bitch it would be her safety out of all my dogs I would worry about the most if anything was to come out of this terrible tragedy although she's much bigger than a pitbull she could also be deemed 'as type' I suppose :-( I really do worry about the kind of future that the Am Bulldog could have - because of all the different strains.

Based on what I've said if he has a staffy type head and is larger than your average staffy then I would class him as a pitbull type which is why it is in your interest to make sure he is chipped, and you have details of his breeders so they can confim what he is and whatever other paper work you can get your hands on.
If you can get a written statement from his breeders even better.
I have to say I never understood when the DDA came in why people risked having staffy crosses because they are pitbull type. As soon as the word 'type' came into it people should have been extra cautious.
Becky

Here is a picture of him taken on xmas day, 4.5mths old:


I got him off a friend of mine, so I know the history of his parents very well. His mother is a SBT and his father is a Scott type AB. He gets his looks from his dad and has the temperament of his mother. I wouldn't class him as a pitbull 'type' but I am confused now this pitbull thing has come alive in the media again.

Oh and was just about to forget to mention that I had him chipped when he was 8wks old

Judging from how broad his head is, and that it will only get broader, you will probably be OK. However, I would strongly recommend getting him and his parents (if your friends will do it) DNA profiled that way you can prove what he is.
Becky

There are thousands of Staffy X's which don't even resemble pitbulls waiting for homes in shelters across the UK and I think thats a really unfair thing to say.
It's really difficult to acertain what could be deemed 'as type' without the help of an expert...Lab crosses too lets not forget have also been siezed in the past under this dreadful act and so too have DDB crosses. I suppose with any 'Bully' breed it's a risk you take...

Most people ask me if he is a staff, I always say yes he's a cross. They then comment on the size of him and say he's gonna be massive. You would not believe the amount of people who have asked me if he is a pitbull though. It kinda pisses me off now when I get asked.

My friend who I got Georgie from, owns 9 AB's I think now. He has also just bred a litter of them. I haven't spoken to him since this new years day tradgedy, but I am sure he would be confused over it all too. I will have to speak to him.

There are millions upon millions of staffy crosses nationwide. They seem to be one of the most popular breeds around, especially where I live.

I would never say that having a staffy cross was a risk though.....I've got one at the end of the day.

TeenyTiny I dont want to say you should worry, because i dont want to put fear in your mind
Not to long ago a Scotts AB was imported and then as it got to the uk the Idiots refused entry and called it a Pitbull Type, which sadly caused alot of upset for the poor would be owners and the dog was sent back
The people they employ to dictate what a pitbull or pitbull type is are complete fools who generally dont know what they are doing

This mainly worries me because many dogs without pitbull blood may end up being pts, I just hope that it does not happen

I completely agree Hayley!
How many more innocent dogs are going to lose their lives

it is a very worrying time nissian, at the end of the day only someone with real exp with bull breeds can do the job and because they have a love for the breed then they wont do the job, so they will get any old person with little DOG know how let alone BULL BREED exp in!

So basically any stafford x lab, stafford x ab, stafford x mastiff breed could be pts, because u cant say be eye alone and every dogs (EVERY BREED) temperment is depending how its brought up if a dog has pitbull blood in, they are not like samoyed where there is little variation, the stafford and pitbull come in so many different shapes and sizes, just like ab with the hines, painter, scott and johnson! its impossible which is where BSL and DDA just show what crap it is

I meant having a staffy cross is a risk for being siezed under the DDA and destroyed, as no doubt will be proved over the next few weeks.
Becky

But I don't think it was a 'Scott' type AB that was refused entry..It was a 'Blackchamps' dog..Blackchamps being the kennel name of the breeders, Blackchamps breed their own 'version' of what they think an American Bulldog should be and their strain contains Pit Blood you can read all about them here http://www.blackchamps.com/

I agree the people they employ must be complete d!ck heads coz how can anyone think a Scott AB looks anything like a PBT? 2 totally different dogs :?

i asked a police friend of mine if I should take my Irish staff along to my local police station to have the experts they are using to determine if a dog is a pit or not give her the all clear, his advice was as follows! "don't be so f***in stupid the vet they are using couldn't tell the differance between a pit and a KC reg staff yesterday!" i live not 2 miles away from the house where the little girl was mauled to death on new years day! if the local police can't get a real expert this close to where the tragedy took place what chance do our dogs have?

My understanding is that Pit Bulls are a specific breed of dog. However the DDA talks about the Pit Bull and the Pit Bull type dog. A Pit Bull type is a dog who is has some physical characteristics and temperament as a Pit Bull. This, very vague definition, is included in the DDA to give police far wider abilities to seize what they consider to be dangerous dogs. There are no actual objective tests to determine a Pit Bull type. The tests are subjective and dependant on the "experts" the police decide to prove their case.

Essentially any dog resembling a Pit Bull who the police take a disliking to could potentially be at risk. That includes very large Staffords.

Your best reassurance and defence is to ensure your dog is never in trouble and well cared for. Have photos of the dog's parents and contact details of the parents' owners and keep any records to show that you are a responsible owner and your dog is well trained and kept under control. Personally I would also suggest not outfitting your dog in traditional bull terrier wear as it just draws attention to the dog.

Obviously all this is moot if your dog gets into trouble on public land. Then there are a greater range of laws that can be used against any breed of dog.

as the original thread asks "what is a pitbull", this was my old dog max, a purebred pitbull, he is wearing a muzzle because of the DDA. This is the only pic I have of him,