Hello Everyone I'm new to the site & looking for some advice please on our beautiful Saluki Pups Behaviour

Hi, what a lovely forum and it's been wonderful to have found this and to have had a read through messages.

My name is Laura, nice to meet you all, I have two 16 week old Saluki pups Flynn and Ada, who are just wonderful. They are brother and sister and we have had them since 9 weeks old.

They are kennel club registered and we got to meet the mother (who was originally imported from Dubai), their father and all the other pups. Their temperaments are loving and very sweet natured.

For Flynn though unfortunately he is absolutely terrified of other dogs. It's total terror, if a dog comes near him he will wee himself uncontrollably, he will scream and frantically try to get away - fight or flight mode. Ada, his sister is much calmer albeit she is still uncertain but not to the same level. We have not knowledge that there has been any kind of traumatic experience for him with dogs because we haven't really been out around any. I am sure it's due to the lack of socialisation?

I know they are young, however we have gone to puppy socialisation classes (he can't last in there as he can't spend more than a second in the same vicinity as another dog) we have had trainers, behaviourists, we've taken him down to the beach ourselves to sit with him and how him from a distance that there is no harm to come to him but nothing is working, if anything he is getting worse.

It's Flynn I feel for as he should be able to run free and enjoy that time with other dogs, instead it's turning into a nightmare for him.

We live on the coast, and every morning I walk them off leash, their recall is great and they stay close by all the time, however the beach is always deserted so there is not much dog activity going on and they feel safe there. As soon as we go to a busier beach it's absolute chaos, and if a dog goes anywhere near Flynn you would think that someone is murdering him ;-(

Has anyone got any ideas? will this phase get better or does this need some more serious behavioural training?

I have started taking them out separately as we have been told that litter pups need to be separated so I will keep you all posted on how that goes.

Thank you for taking the time to read (and possibly respond to my message)

Thanks Laura, Flynn and Ada

Hello Laura and welcome to Breedia, i'm new here myself but had staffs put not your breed sorry but I have read about dogs behaving in this manner from pups and it can come from being bullied from their brothers and sisters although it may sound mad plus it causes panic attacks and anxiety as they feel the same as humans.

https://www.petcarerx.com/article/how-to-know-if-your-dog-has-anxiety/702

I think your training needs to work around less fear of dogs and keep them on their lead being young and try slowly to let another friendly dog be friendly with Flynn, as it does help break the symptoms even if it's stressing yourself.

The first time my puppy saw another dog, I was holding him and walking up to a Starbucks where a giant Akita was, my puppy screamed bloody murder. Everyone in the area stopped to look at us he was so loud and frantic. I knew this Akita and knew she was extremely mellow and kind dog, so I walked up to her and just put Max down, he finally stopped and she came up to him and sniffed him and he just sat by my legs, we stayed like that and then he got curious and sniffed at her. Now when he sees her he is fine. I would definitely keep him on a leash and only introduce him to mellow, calm dogs for the time being, go slow. I think finding the right kinda dogs to introduce him too would be important. I’m not a trainer just my thoughts. Good luck.

@Margo8478 that's just how I would do it...you need people you know with dogs with happy personalities to introduce your dog to

Hi, and thank you @Brunniebabe and @Margo8478 for your replies.

That does make sense and I was thinking along the same lines about keeping them on a lead whilst introducing them to other dogs. The problem we have is that most of the places we walk where there are other dog walkers present are places where they let their dogs off leash. It's then that we can't control what other dogs will do when they come up to Flynn or Ada. We have a trainer coming with her dog on Saturday, so we're hoping that with a little bit of time and encouragement from us he will be fine.

@Brunniebabe thank you for that information, I didn't realise about the sibling bullying? I'll enquire about it.

Sorry for the confusion on the last post. I couldn't remember my password and it looks like I was already a member previously! Hopefully now logged in under correct log in

Two pups at the same time are a handful and more effort to bond and train. It can be done but with great effort. http://www.caninedevelopment.com/Sibling.htm
Puppy socialisation classes can be overwhelming especially for shy puppies and sometimes they can do more harm than good, mainly if they are free-for-alls, with pups running all over the place with no boundaries in place for shy dogs or bullies.

I wouldn’t put him into situations he’s not happy with, find quiet spots where you can just "Sit" and have him "observe" no need to interact with other dogs ,work to getting him to ignore other dogs (at a distance he is happy with) and focus on building your bond/trust with him .
As he gains confidence, at a distance where he seems happy and relaxed, you can gradually work closer, it may take a long time but I wouldn’t rush him.
The point is that socialisation should be a positive experience, if forced into situations that are uncomfortable or stressful then it is not a positive experience.

@FlynnandAda yes pups do bully even when feeding and you always get the odd few pushed out a times but as they grow they also test their skills with one another.

When I purchased my first staffy, the lady told me on the phone he's the last one left being the last of the litter but when I arrived there he was sitting quiet I saw both parents, same in height and build and I said I want to see him walk to make sure he wasn't laim in any way and he turned out to be a right stunner.

Hi Everyone and thank you for your replies.

Just an update as we had a dog behaviourist to help us out today for the first time and it was very successful.

@GsdSlave thank you for your comments as a lot of the work that we did today with Flynn and Ada was based around what you suggested. We used a long line and Emma our trainer brought her dog with her (who was extremely calm and wasn't bothered by what was going on) so it was the perfect combination. We took them out separately, and every time Ada or Flynn made eye contact with Emma's dog we would reward them with positive language and a treat, and we would keep doing that throughout the whole time they were interacting some how with the other dog in a positive way. The long line allowed them to do it at their own pace and under their own self esteem and the main thing was that it wasn't forced.

We are going to keep doing this now until they feel comfortable, but we learnt a lot today and Flynn really seemed to be enjoying himself by the end of the session The other key point was that she was walking around with her dog, but making sure that Flynn and I or Ada and I were having fun with a ball and allowing them to see that it was ok to do so with another dog present. At this stage Flynn and Ada were fully involved in what I was doing as opposed to what was going on around them and the other dog.

We have some progress

Thanks again everyone

@FlynnandAda I am pleased for you laura..it must have felt like one massive achievement and by working on this with friendly dogs should break his fear... and please keep we updated