Now live - German Shepherd Dog profile General Chat

I'm happy to include the SV standard if everyone else is ok with that

Also a quick note re recognised by bit, we're currently sticking with the original profiles of only including the 3 mains registries, KC, FCi and AKC, but when we revamp the profiles we will expand that to all of the main ones, including CKC and specific breed type ones.

Ok added the second draft to the first post.. ok?

Much better. But I do think you need to mention the White Shepherd people. (Berger Blanc Suisse)

Why? They are not GSDs.

You either have a GSD of a non standard colour or you have a separate breed.........

I think calling a GSD a shepherd dog is a bit misleading as the Border Collie is a true shepherd dog= a sheep herding dog that rounds up sheep then contains them in a herd moving them from A to B.

The GSD is better known as a guard dog to move among'st and watch over livestock (ie. sheep) and protect from predators rather than herding.

So you consider being a living fence, a guarding role rather than a herding/containment role then?

And thus do all breeds that contain the word Shepherd thus not herd eg Australian Shepherd Dog, Belgian Shepherd Dog etc?

The clue is in the name

Then say that as with Boxers, White GSDs are occasionally thrown because there was a white dog in their ancestry. This mixed ancestry is also responsible for the coat differences. Some people have liked the white ones and have bred them together deliberately but as a non-standard colour they cannot be shown.

It depends how you interpret the word shepherd= if the breed herds rather than guards yes it is a shepherd.

I would call it a miss-use of the word shepherd if the breed is a guard rather than a herder.

Many breeds have been used as driving dogs with drovers of sheep but that is not the same as herding sheep.

Precisely my point.

A white GSD is a white GSD, it is not another breed.

If it IS another breed then it does not belong in the GSD Breed Standard.

Non standard colours appear in most breeds.
Non standard colours will not win anything in the breed ring.
Non standard coats will not win anything in the breed ring.

White Boxers have not been called A N Other breed. They are Boxer dogs which are white.

I guess we need to tell the KC to remove the GSD from the pastoral group then?

Very good suggestion they should be in the working dog group.

In which case `undesirable` should be removed from the breed description and `non-standard` inserted.

I like the word undesireable, it gives people a clue (if they care to look) that certain things are NOT desireable in a breed and should not be specifically bred for!

Not all of them herd - Anatolian Shepherd Dog for instance....

Sue

The GSD was developed to Shepherd stock-hence the name they are not German Guard Dogs(they have the Dobermann, Rottweiler & Boxer to guard) do you think that the Belgian & Dutch Shepherd dogs should also go into the Working Group ??

Oh dear you really do not know anything about the GSD do you.

The German Shepherd Dog is still using to do the job it was developed to do-Shepherd the stock-ie act in the place of the Human Shepherd when he/she is not present. They take the sheep/cattle from pasture to pasture(hence they are Pastoral), they are shown a line(walked by the Human Shepherd)past which the stock are not to graze. The dog then "patrols"the line keeping the stock in place. They were never meant to guard the stock from "wolves", theft, etc What the dog guards is the pasture not to be grazed by the stock from the stock.

The flock guards-like the Anatolians, Kusaz etc etc bond with the sheep & protect them & nothing else-should they all be in the Working Group too ??

Pastoral refers to where the breeds were developed to work

Wow you learn something new everyday on Dogsey, I found this quite educational, thanks Dyane:

But your first sentence is undesirable

So is the general consensus now that the second draft is ok?

Maybe I should explain in the colour section, that whites are undesirable only from the show breed/standard perspective?

Actually German breeds of sheep do not respond to white GSDs which is why it is a disqualifying fault in the SV breed standard-most continental breeds of sheep don't respond to white dogs-one reason the European Flock guards are usually white(Komandor for example)