I have to ask - what is the problem? Discussions

Seriously,
Why are NI/BI/UTE owners having to watch there chosen breed ripped to bits?

DOGSEY- THE SITE FOR DOG LOVERS

We all love our dogs so why is there such a issue why cant we just get along or is it a boredom thing?
A few get bored and decide to have a quick go I understand that but if your that bored why not take your dogs out or hoover?
Now I know a lot of people dislike the breeders and all the secrecy etc etc but its 20 odd years later! We cant change the past nor can we tell breeders intent on breeding poor quality and ill dogs to stop they're hardly likely to listen now are they?

I dont claim my dogs to be wolfy looking and a lot of my NI owner friends dont either, I've seen gsd's look more wolfier than mine but i dont spit my dummy out n cry over it

What im trying to ask is what is the issue, is it the dogs in general? Is it the owners? or is it the breeders?
If its the breeders then there are NO DECENT NI breeders on here anyway so its kinda a moo point starting a row.

This will either be locked asap or end up in a slanging match neither are my intentions im genuinly curious (hence the smiley) as to what the issues are?

Jem, just enjoy the dogs,show us what they can do or not do. Its a funny ol thing with this breed, not because of the dogs but with the secrecy & lies & Money making schemes. Obvisly some (most) people just love their pets (like yourself) & thats the bits i want to see now tbh!!!!

arent the issues just amongst yourselves?

we have an NI in my village. the owner has nothing to do with any of the societies, has heard of all the bitchin', finds all these 'NI whatever you want to call them people' silly, and doesnt have anything to do with anything of them.
she has a great dog, my akita x fancies him.

Mine dont really do much to be honest I think they take after me with that one

No hun x

if you go by the threads and arguments on dogsey, and the multiple breakaway splinter organisations and their own websites, that is where the evidence points to.

and think the vast majority of us on dogsey find it either amusing (in my case) or odd.
the general public knows nothing of it.
some wolfy looking dogs owners, like my friend in my village, dont care or know little about any of the arguments/groups.

But what im asking is what is the issue amongst non NI owners?
The NIS dont whinge amongst themselves, I dont know about any other groups to be honest so cant comment.
I have no experience with other groups x

I personally find it very funny when it really all goes to pot on here and only get involved when i know 100% lies are being told or my dogs are involved but then surely isn't that like any other dog owner no matter the breed?

I'm a non-NI owner, and I have no issues at all.

Same here

I don't have issues with ANY breed, just some stupid, irresponsible owners :?

Thanks for the reply guys xx

You have said it yourself Jem, you cant change the past, but you CAN change the future, unfortunately those breeders that continue to do things as they did all those years ago, i.e dont health test, use poor specimens, none standard colours etc... are doing the breed no favours and it cant get any better can it?

I also agree with you on the "Wolfie" things, cant for the life of me see why people post pictures of dogs with their heads down and think they look like Wolves! They dont!

I also think if people were GENUINELY interested in the HEALTH of these dogs they would stop breeding them, and the same goes for all factions, groups etc... I think the real issue they WANT them to LOOK like Wolves, NOT healthy animals, because if they did really want healthy dogs they wouldnt use the NI to breed from, run the NI down, say its full of this and that and then backtrack, mate one to something else and claim its ok!

I dont have a problem with any of the dogs, seriously, I have problems with unethical breeding, liars, mass production to supply the pet market and people taking advantage of others.

probably a slanging match, then locked

Thanks Ladies x

I'm a non NI owner and I don't have a problem either.

I can see what Krusewalker's friend would mean though.
I do think if I had an NI I would be avoiding this section like the plague. ( Came in here today, cos I saw it was you asking, Jem )

Mind you, I don't post tons in the terrier section anyway.. maybe that's because I consider myself a dog lover first and time is short, so I tend to stay in the General areas.

Personally I'm quite glad of it... NI/BI/utes etc are gorgeous dogs, no questions there, but without Dogsey I wouldn't have a clue that they even had health issues. I was thinking about getting one, one day... But unless someone can pull a miracle out of their behind I think I'll stick to rescues *g*
It does get somewhat repetitive to hear the same info being trotted out, and you can never be sure who's fibbing and who's not, but I think not talking about it would be less helpful. For dog-newbies like me anyway! :wink:

I think it can become dull, like same old same old, but I do understand some of the members reasons for doing so.

as for NI folk dont fight amoung themselfs...bhahahahahahah

sandra currie/julie K/charlie R.......... world war 3....daily..

they fight worse than anyone.

It's funny because I was wondering the same thing myself this morning. There seems to never be a thread on this subject that doesn't turn nasty. Some of the things that are said on these threads really cross the line (imo) and I have wanted to ask what all the trouble is about but, as I know absolutely nothing about the breed, I'd probably be ignored in any case. These threads don't seem about discussion or education, just arguing and slanging. Quite strange.

It got a bit like that on some of the Chi sites, hence me leaving and coming to a general dog site. I thought it might be very different. Dogsey, in general, is a much nicer place than I found the Chi sites but, like you say, the wolfy threads do get quite scary at times

I have to say I think it is a huge pity that there is all this bitching and griping amongst them all.

It has got to a point whereby I no longer want to look at most NI posts simply because I know there it will all erupt into back-biting.

It's a shame as I am always interested to hear about other peoples breeds usually!

Jem, as fellow NI owner I don't think anyone actually has a go at the actual dogs. The only time this may appear to happen is when someone comes on here, for example, and says 'I am going to be breeding from my dog/bitch' when anyone can see it is not a good example, or those people have only just got their first dog and are going to breed...... anything like that. But it's not against the actual dogs.

I am also a NI who is a member of all the different forums relating to all the different factions. Yes, I must hold the record for not being banned from any.
The reason is I don't get involved in slanging matches etc. All I want is the truth or at least to follow any problems that may or may not be in the future for my dog. Will the truth ever come out? Probably not.

Would I get another NI? No, not unless it was a rescue. Not because of the dogs themselves as such but because of the people involved who haven't got the decency to ever get themselves together and sort this mess out.

They are lovely dogs, but any breeding done at the moment is being done without the propers foundations of health testing, true pedigrees etc so at the moment any tests done are a bit like shutting the door after the horse has bolted IMO.

Jem, enjoy your dogs as dogs, that's what good NI owners do.

In a nutshell, the lies about the start of the breeding which continue today, the total lack of any shred of ethics at the start - some of which is still happening today, lack of health testing, [ don`t forget even something as basic as hip scoring has only become a recent `requirement` in any of the factions, a disgrace especially as one of the founder breeds which still show strong appearance/build traits have a dreadful record for HD and ED ], lack of any cohesive adherence to a `standard`, lack of a properly thought out standard even now, the secrecy, the fake `pedigree`s, the behaviour generally of some involved in the breeding, new breed names for the same lines when breeders fall out with this or that faction, and the feelings regarding deliberate crossbreeding to produce a `breed` which was never properly thought out from the start when there are more than enough properly established breeds to suit every purpose they could possibly be wanted for whether for working or purely as companions - is that enough to be going on with ;-)

*Just to reiterate what has already been said, not one of us who genuinely care about all dogs have ever had a go in a nasty way at the dogs themselves - the dogs are not responsible for the whole mess the humans involved have caused.

It can be like that with many breeds cant it!!! Hey Jem just be grateful you dont have a "show" type or a "working" type !!! then you would know trouble!