Wolf lookalike breeders Controversial

Imo the reason that some gsd lines have the problem is due to breeder wanting to achieve maximum stride length with the hind legs, ie. over reaching. that is why they are bred how they are. But you are right the gsd needs some improvements- and to be fair all the gsds from germany have a good hip score.
Needless to say mine are both working line 'straight back' types and I dont like to see exaggerated dogs.

Of course a wolf looking dog is going to look more 'natural' than some other breeds-thats like me trying to breed a dog with the temperament of a gsd into the body of a lab!! what would be the point in that? personal preference? Because thats all breeding to look like a wolf is. what will happen when that goal is reached then? when you haver the spitting image of a wolf-what next? I really dont see the point in breeding to look like a wolf-what does it achieve because they are not wolves in temperament and behaviour and never will be!

Why is all the Saarloos on Shoshone not hip scored?

why dont you phone shoshone and ask her, that way you will get the correct answer.
unless of course that would be too easy and it would mean you couldnt speculate and make assumptions.

just to make it easier for you.the contact detail are on her website for you as you probably know, so why ask the question here when shosohone have the correct info for you.

Just looked on the Shoshone website and the welcome page is SOOOO confusing and i have no idea what they actually breed! They are called British Wolf dog, just wolf dog, British Inuit wolf lookalike dog and hybrid wolf dogs! LOL

ummm seems she breeds Labradoodles as well so she must be raking it in! Must say she owns an AWFUL lot of dogs . . . there is one litter of Saarloos, 2 litters of crosses 1 pup from an older litter and 2 litters planned for April . . As well as one litter of Labradoodles!!!!!

The shoshone site shows the saarloos with hip scores of AA Kc ?? does that mean they are not hip scored ?
or is that a way of scoring abroad ?
I have never heard of the AA before looking at the shoshone site...

So they are hipscored then.

Yes that is how they do it abroad, AA is a good score

best hipscores you can get equivelant to 00. european.

Surely that many litters and breeds its a puppy farm?
NI, CWD, Saarloos and labradoodles

does anyone have a certificate they can post a piccie of ?
you can blank out the private details, I would like to see the difference between theres and ours ?

didnt we establish previously that if you want to call it a puppy farm then do.
if its done correctly then so what.
are you not able to target irresponsible breeders in your spare time, although i wouldnt have thought you would have much spare time running a rescue place.

A-1 actually means 0:0 and is written as a normal score not the very best you can get ...

I'm sorry but i have to agree, if you look at the thread 'what makes a place a puppy farm' these were some of the key things . . Multiple breeds, lots of litter pups always avalible.

A place doesn't have to be dirty or the dogs in a state to still be a puppy farm. This is clearly a very comercial (sp?)breeder that breeds for profit and nothing else.

How can breeders with so many puppies on the ground put in all the care and attention the pups would need, especially with the saarloo which needs early socialisation ?

Esp as these are kennel breed dogs so the pups will need a bit more time spending with them . . . I have nothing against kennelled dogs (my BIL's working dogs all live in out door kennels) but with pups it does mean a bit more work after weaning getting them used to normal housey stuff.

Agree with you there, plus exercising and keeping the adults socialized. They must have a hell of a lot of staff to do this, if it is done properly. We have heard on here from good breeders how much work is involved in bringing up just 1 litter.

Does anyone know the average age for hip scoreing a saarloo or cvwd ?

European hipscore - AA

If you're on H&H forum then ask finnishlapphund to explain it to you, she wrote a brilliant post in one thread on there. She will possible also scan one and show you.

I was told that any more than 2 breeds constitutes a puppy farm, however when you look at one of the top terrier show kennels in the UK, they show and breed Airdales, Wire fox, Sealyham, Welsh terrier, Lakeland and Irish terriers... so, are they a puppy farm?