Mr & Mrs Wolf Tonight on 5 Shaun Ellis! General Chat

If you actually took the trouble to find out the facts, instead of just making pointless, bitchy and very childish personal remarks, you would be able to answer a lot of your own questions.

One things for sure, if he got me doing excersing on machine like he did his GF after a long day.....I'd defo be no good in bed either.................

And what really ''P'd'' me off was him sitting in the other room...then going down to his ''Wolf Family'' as he knew she was annoyed at him insisting she exercised............I'd of wrapped something round his head........and it wouldn't be me either

I can see Pat being asked by Channel 5 and National Geographic to do a follow up to Living with the Wolves......

'Living with Steph (you thought the wolves were scary)';-)

Oh! that made me laugh so much.

It's funny coz it's true Steph .... and that's why we loves ya!

I've never watched any of SE's stuff & never looked at any artificial/tame pack sites etc.

I much prefer the research & observations of David Mech, who has a lifetime of experience of real wolves in real wolf packs.

He has learnt over the last 40 years that his original concepts & publication were erroneous in some aspects, especially that of the so called Alpha's in the packs. I've been sledged on many forums etc about MHO that there is little conflict in a real wolf pack, because they are headed by the parents of all the wolves in the pack. Obviously for those who believe in the Alpha being in control via force they have never read any of David's more recent works

He has some brilliant pictures on his site like these

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Yes, he is a person I have heard of, thanks for the link. His observations have been done with his eyes and not being stupid enough to think the Wolves are accepting him as a pack memeber because he cowers on his back or shares a deer carcass with them! Natural behaviour is exhibited when you observe and watch not join in!

Dawn : I am curious here. What experience do you have of wolves? Have you ever met Shaun Ellis? Have you ever interacted with wolves ever?

Nope, have you interacted with a pack of Wolves? It isnt something Id feel comfortable with, hence the refusal of "walkies" with them, when offered the opportunity. Wolves should be kept wild and not ridculed, nor mated with siblings, does abnsolutely nothing for Wolves, conservation or anything else connected to their welfare, my opinion of course.

I am loved, I am loved.....awwwwww cheers hun

Well you aint gonna get slated by me on this one I have long wondered about the term alpha when the alpha pair were infact the parents of the wolf pack
Seems lots of people just really liked the idea of the dom wolf leading with force
- but in reality thats us just humanising things

There is some really interesting wolf studies been done recently and some experts who really seem to know what they are talking about - but unfort the tv cameras really dont care for the truth - just good tv and someone with an ego larger than their love for the animals

He has changed a lot.

We first met him in the late '90s he was quite different then.

Who SE or David Mech ? David certainly hasn't changed in personality, only his depth of knowledge of the wild wolf has increased. SE I have no knowledge of

Yup, and I completely disagree with you, which is my right.

I personally hold the view that when someone doesn't know what they are talking about, they should go away and learn before making not only libellous remarks about private individuals, but more importantly, finding out as much as they can about the subject to avoid looking ignorant in the future.

Shaun -(Sorry assumed people would understand)

We first met him when he was working with the Longleat pack - I don't think he has changed his theories at all - just his attitude.

We then went to a talk with him organised down here - I was still competeing regularly at agility so must have been '98 or '99 - since then I have been to 3 other talks with him and he has also come over and helped us with a feral dog we have.

LOL I've been lucky enough to hear David give presentations & his knowledge is awesome & unlike those who have far less knowledge-he admits he is always learning & will never know everything-no one ever could.

To say that you have to physically interact with a wild animal to know it & it's behaviour-is well I can't say on here what I really think, but shall I say that any behaviours shown would be altered if the animals are in captivity & even being physically involved with non captive wild animals like wolves, modifies their behaviour to a certain degree.

The true experts with indepth knowledge of the behaviours & lifestyles of wild animals, are those who discreetly observe them & do not seek or want physical contact or interaction. Even the Great Ape specialists do not directly seek to involve themselves with our nearest living relatives. If the animal chooses to give contact that is a different matter, not all Great apes are as easy going as the Orangutans.

You make me smile Gnasher, however given your track record of lying about your own dog and calling people on here liars too when they disagreed with you, I think Ill refrain from trying to appease your obvious intellect!

In what way did he help you? I thought the dog was still unhandlable and still wild?

The dog is still unhandleble - to a point. You can stroke him now and he will come when he is called - even play with a ball - but thats a differnt (very long story)

Shaun - using the bodylanguage and calming signals he used with the wolves was the first person to get a positive response from the dog when he was with us.

Its a bit difficult to explain - everyone had been trying to tell me that I needed to use food with Pip - I myself would have suggested that had I been asked about the situation.
I have never come across a dog willing to starve itself in order to avoid people...but that may be becasue of how he was caught.

Shaun came in and suggested some other ways and some bodylanguage to try. I'm not saying it was an instant solution - but it was the first step forwards.