100% Wolf X Dog Controversial

Eko,

Its funny how no matter how much they bang on about Mr Ellis, they never actually say what is incorrect in his work (or book) and yes Wolfpark can do much more with their wolves; they managed to get one to jump through a hoop, I believe. Maybe they were worried Mr Ellis might be competition at the Circus!!!

Here is a link if you want to see wolves doing circus tricks:

http://www.wolfpark.org/training/Example-4.html

Thanks, she's gorgeous, lovely eyes.

Perhaps this might shed some light...

Robin Rigg
www.slovakwildlife.org

For the last 11 years I've been researching wolves, wolf diet and wolf-human conflicts in Slovakia, which shares the same population of wolves as Poland, where Shaun has done some of his work.

At the end of last year I was in Poland to attend an expert seminar on the conservation and management of wolves and other carnivores in the Carpathian Mountains. I asked Polish wolf researchers if they knew about Shaun's work. These are professional people whose full-time work is studying wolves in the wild in Poland: their territorial behaviour, when and why they howl, how to protect livestock from predators. I was surprised to find that they had never heard of Shaun Ellis.

I described Shaun's work to them. In their opinion, playing recordings of wolf howls is likely to attract wolves, not repel them, as Shaun has claimed. The explanation they gave is that resident wolves would be anxious to defend their territory from intruders and so would tend to approach the source of any howling they heard coming from within their territory. The researchers I spoke to have personal experience of this from their own work in playing recorded howling.

Yes I have heard some say that howls will attract and some say they wont. Howling to attract wolves has been popular for decades in Canada, though not heard of them approaching as they seem to keep their distance.

I heard that the Polish forestry guy was very popular when he visited Coombe Martin some years ago, especially at the pub!

She is listed on the Saarloos database online if you want to have a look. I wouldn't say she's small, but she's not tall either, I'll measure her later as off to ride out the pointers now.

I can see that this would be true but not in the way Shaun did it. Shaun observed the pack and it's numbers before making the recording. No pack of say 5 wolves (purely an example) would take on a pack with numbers of 10+.

And for anyone questioning Shauns cleanliness, I think you could see he was clean on the Alan Titchmarsh show just now.

This is interesting- so you were in Poland with him when he played the recordings?

If "howling" recordings and Wolf pee worked in Poland etc.. why then would thesed "rent a packs" be necessary? I mean moving animals around will cause stress and tension etc.. could end in fights and problems all round, why not keep on with the howling tapes and pee?

Obviously not! But then you already knew the answer to your question.

Were you there? Did you watch the programme properly?

Obviously not! But then you already knew the answer to your question.

Were you there? Did you watch the programme properly?

Can you explain these, I haven't even heard about it!

I believe it was a thought of SE to use the F1 hybrids or something to "rent out" and use as deterrents, in preference to the pee thing.

No I wasn't there and neither was anybody else on this thread. That's my point. Apart from what was shown for the filming of 'The Wolfman', there is no documented evidence of Shaun Ellis's studies in Poland or the U.S.A. There is no mention of the Poland work on the Wolf Pack Management web site. All of the information on wolves on there has been copied directly from Wikipedia. Where are these farmers in Poland that have been helped by Shaun's methods? Where is the evidence of the success of these methods? Why do the biologists and the authorities in Poland not know anything about him?

Regardless, I think it is quite obvious that if you play a recording of 10-15 wolves to a pack of 4 or 5 wolves, the smaller pack are unlikely to take on the larger pack.

His work in Poland and the US is being investigated and it appears to have been staged for the TV rather than real research. Poland have strict management and study procedures for their Indigenous species which is run by a government body and they know exactly which of their biologists are working with which species in which areas.

Howler boxes have been used in the US for some years with mixed results and it isnt a new theory discovered by Shaun infact he probably heard about it when there.

Biologists have recorded that often a higher number of wolves have been called to an area to investigate the howling even when defensive howls are used.

I agree that the website is just rubbish but I think SE allows some volunteer to do it as a hobby.

There was an exhibition of this Poland project at Coombe Martin some 5 years ago as I recall, including lots of photos. I remember speaking to a Polish speaking lady who had been involved as well. She outlined some of the practical details. I couldn't say how far the project got but I later saw that the Nat Geo program was shown there and it was featured in one of the big magazines in Poland.

Anyone who wants to do something constructive about CR & SE's project can p.m me and I will give you the council's contact details.

Surely you mean destructive, bitter and twisted?

... you forgot one ! Jealous too