This is a pie in the sky at the moment I'm afraid.. Now I love collies, all collies. I'd love one one day and it would most likely be a rescue, but I do wonder.. Is there that much difference between a WSD and a show/obedience/sport line, aside from looks? I have heard that WSDs need more exercise and stimulation but will happily settle when theres nothing much going on but show lines have more difficulty reaching their 'off' switch. Is there any truth in that? I do prefer the variety of the WSD but the show lines are gorgeous too, I'd rather get the right dog than worry about the looks. The mental and physical exercise I'm fine with, I get bored easily so I'd have to vary it to amuse myself let alone the dog but I think Jobie and I may struggle with a dog who couldn't chill out with a toy and a cuddle in the evenings or leave me alone for a few hours while I do my assignments and such (kongs are my friends, right ) Also, I was reading in a thread where someone mentioned that their WSDs were very calm and laid back in the house when nothing was going on and that was how they were brought up to act, how would you do that? is it just a case of providing enough mental/physical exercise or do you need to teach them how to relax as such? i feel such a pull towards collies, they are amazing... but i have had to give up a dog before because she was so demanding (im sure i would have coped fine with her now) and i dont want to go down that path again, even if it means only being able to admire them from afar :-( so im being very cautious. thanks
A WSD is not registered, my lad is technically a WSD but had we paid the reg he could have been a BC just he was never going to be shown and WS was sufficient for obedience and agility. There is a massive difference between some WS and some BCs but then there are huge differences between KC reg BCs too ....
I've had collies from working stock for 15 years - two until Snorri-dog died, and now a new pup. All were farm-born. It's early doors to tell about the pup, but Kali and Snorri were always happy enough to lounge about in the house all day, if nothing was happening. They were equally happy to go out for a walk or a rampage on the beach, but didn't insist on the outings. They were quite naturally laid-back like that. My first Border-boy was a rescue, we never knew anything about his origins, but he looked "show-bred". He was happy to slob out, too (and was equally willing to go for a long traipse, as well). Any of my boys have been happy to give out the heavy Zs when left to it. Snorri
Never noticed a difference. We have always had WSD's (although one is ISDS - but a failed herder). We have had 2 'Proper' BC's both from showing/obedience lines......they are both nutcases! (In a nice way). They both have a very strong herding instinct (that they direct towards our other dogs!), but it is much more pronounced than in the others. One is a Tenita and one is a Stillmoor.
The best thing to do is find the breeder/farmer and ask what the dogs are like You will find all sorts of mixtures in both working and show depending on what the person breeding them wants Personaly I prefer the working dog As for teaching an off switch, basic good manners, giving the dog enough to do to quiet its mind and body and crate training I have found something like a nothing in life is free training works pretty well where they have to do something to get something, Sitting nicely before they get fuss, Lieing before the door is opened, all teaches impulse control and good manners I think if you set out expecting the worst collie puppie from hell and train for that then you can only get nice surprises
I think it varies within both types, look at the parents/lines and research what those dogs are like. Felix is Kc & ISDS and is the laziest dog in the world in the house, Indy and Harry both have some show lines and are equally lazy in the house! I think alot of it is what they learn growing up as well x
true true TBH if you are not in a hurry then just look about- your dog will find you I was on the lookout for a nice farm collie and ended up with Ben - and he was totaly the best choise for me - he chose me - I wasnt even there looking at his litter
The ISDS actually register the dogs as WSD(or Border Collies)Historically(no matter what anyone says)Border Collies are the sheepdogs born & bred in the borders of Scotland & England & Wales & England. All the others are WSD. The KC opted to call all dogs from ISDS registered parents as BCs & the others WSD when the breed was first registered on the old Kennel Club Obedience Register. When the KC recognized the BC as a "Breed"of dog then all the Border Collies from the KCOR were transferred to the full register & after that these dogs offspring were called BC, along with any dogs that are ISDS registered, have a mother & father who are ISDS registered, have a mother that is KC reg & a father who is ISDS reg (& Vica Versa) plus imported dogs who are registered with another KC. The last may have dogs from the USA & Canada that are registered with American Border Collie Association (ABCA) & Canadian Border Collie Association (CBCA) added to the ISDS registered as BCs , as the ISDS are now accepting dogs from these register. Also some KC WSD have other breeds behind them in their bloodlines(one very well known Obedience line has a Labrador bitch)& others are from totally unknown backgrounds & are registered as WSD because they look like a BC but have no paperwork. these dogs are on the Activities Register. I personally would always opt for an ISDS dog, in fact I intend to buy in an ISDS bitch so that I can continue the bloodlines of my KC reg only dog(who actually has a lot of ISDS dogs behind him quite close up). I have a dog in mind for the father of the bitch as he has masses of drive, but like my dogs I now have a sort of off/on switch(which his puppies all seem to inherit) What I will say is that I would never buy a dog from untested parents, even if the parents work etc etc. Having seen other people's major health problems with untested registered/unregistered dogs(HD, CEA(Severe almost blindness), Epilepsy(most recently a very well known Obedience WSD is the sire of two epileptic puppies in the same litter(& these are not the first from this dog nor his father) as well as other health problems that can be tested for.
Excellent news that you admire collies They are wonderful Regarding what type you get (collie from working stock, an obedience or show bred dog), I would think that would depend on what you want to do with it. If you have something specific in mind - ie herding, agility, flyball, obedience or show, then there are breeders who specialise in breeding for the different disciplines. I personally only have ISDS registered dogs (and we do have two unregistered work dogs as well). My hubby is a shepherd and therefore needs collies for work (sheep) and therefore we always look to working parents and other shepherds or farmers for our next working acquisition (or hubby has bred a couple of litters himself). Regarding an on/off switch - all of our dogs seem to have that, thank goodness ;-) I think most of it is down to the fact that the dogs are using their body and brains to a sufficient level on a daily basis. I must say though I have taken the decision not to own a pet collie myself again. They are too demanding as a pet now I have a baby son to look after as well, and will always have my hubby's collies to walk and work in any event (so it will be GSDs exclusively for me from now on). I think anyone taking on a (working bred) collie needs to be aware just how hard-wired for work some of these dogs are, and how they can be extremely demanding and time-consuming in an average pet home. I won't be popular when I say I don't think they actually make particularly good pets - although given the right amount of stimulation (mental and physical) they do seem to live quite happily in that environment. I guess what I am trying to say, from my experience, is that think VERY carefully before deciding to have a collie as a pet, and if you decide the breed is for you then have a long, hard think about what you want to do with the dog and find the right breeder for your needs accordingly
I don't have a clue what lines any of mine have come from, all being rescue...but they have all been chilled around the house providing they have been well exercised physically and mentally. For mine, this means between 2 and 2.5 hours off lead walks a day (the walks include ball games, 'find it' and a bit of training). They are oblivious of the weather and expect to go out no matter what the conditions are, even if it is pelting rain/deep snow/freezing winds - they just don't notice. But I love them and personally I love having dogs that make me get out with them, whatever the weather..otherwise it would be way too easy for me to be a coach potato
ditto wot Moobli sed! The only slight qualification I might make is that IF you find a nice, domesticated collie that can live happily and gently in a family home, then he/she would make an excellent pet, BUT they are not that common. I reckon I've been lucky with Kali and Snorri - too early to tell about Thorgeir yet !: ) Snorri
Thankyou everyone I guess it's just a matter of finding the right breeder or individual dog then! I did have a couple of good breeders in mind if I were to go for a pup, and a rescue if I wanted an older one.. Just need the right circumstances now.. one day
I like My WS ob lines dogs!!!! Bit Nuts ,Nice looking , not Too extreme in coat or head, Tons of drive & cleverness Example of OB type WS
perhaps other people could put up a pic of their dogs of different type , so we can see the different types????
Siren - Ob and Show line BC.....also has a lot of ISDS in her background Head shot Body shot (sorry a bit rubbish) I know a lot of her relations, they all have fantastic temperments and are great working dogs. They do take a long time to mature though which some people don;t like. However - I would recommend her lines to anyone. Border collie...Voderville lines
Or the OP could have a look at this thread, as there are plenty of different types of BC here ... http://www.dogsey.com/showthread.php?t=70966
Ok, got to show my ignorance again Please can someone explain the abbreviations used in this post? Ta.
