Wolf dog shot in head General Chat

in bold- thanks to charlie?

you have some very valid points also some unvalid and i think u and borderdawn need to get your facts straight

Great username! I have only posted what was posted on Charlies forum, how could I have that wrong? Why dont you tell people what they want to hear if you know different instead of spouting silly inuendos!

Is it completely private property? I hope they will be found very soon then.

It's what you need to do if you're introducing a new breed and you don't want to resort to in-breeding two generations down the line!

Sadly, these things happen from time to time. Normally behind 'closed doors' but Charlie opts to be open and up front about everything via his website.

The bitch in question was a semi-feral alpha bitch and it got to the stage where it wasn't even safe to open the door of the run to replace her water. Getting a collar on her was impossible, and if she'd escaped she could have attacked other dogs or humans. I know from speaking to Charlie that he took over a week of looking for viable options before taking the hard decision to euthesise.

And this is not a breed thing. I have two of Charlie's dogs sitting here with me in work. Totally placid, great with the customers, done two workshops recently with the Pet Care Trust where they casually wandered amongst the 'audience'.

It's a shame that this was posted. There are a number of people out to get Charlie - paradoxically because he has such high standards and has waiting lists for his puppies - at the expense of less fastidious breeders.

Not the type of bitch I would think should be bred from!!!

Why is it a shame?? because it highlights the problems??

There are a number of breeders who have both such high standards (or higher) and have long waiting lists also but wouldn't go to those lengths to fill demand..


Personally I think breeding from semi feral dogs and expecting the pups to be ok in normal homes is stretching it a bit!!

i am not here to cause trouble and you all have your own asumtions of what happened or what is happening. i have always thought charlie is a decent bloke and loves his dogs and has a high standard of how he likes his kennels kept....ect but after what has been said about me on the forum and with saarloos i am slightly confused. i have also been bannedfrom the forum. why? because i know to much and so i cant defened myself and so he can cast doubt over all of your thoughts. where all of these rumours have come from that i have been telling everyone he got zsazsa shot i dont know, and would someone tell me who maryanne bingham is? all i can say is i had alot of respect for the guy he breeds fantastic dogs and i had my own reasons for leaving there. i dont want to cause trouble for the bloke but i am hurt that he has wanted to cause trouble for me. someone is behind this all and wants to see him closed down

With regard to in-breeding - wasn't Carlic used on more than one Sarloos bitch? Although I guess this would be taken into account for the future.

Carlic is one of a number of stud dogs, and more than one kennel is involved in the introduction of the breed.

Bob - if you don't have any issues where Sarloos/Charlie is concerned, and if you think they have the wrong end of the stick, why not just e-mail Charlie and put the record straight?

Right, so what I am saying is that - to avoid inbreeding - if Carlic has been used to sire more than one litter, they are presumably logging and taking care not to use pups from one litter that is related to another in the future - through Carlic?

Maybe 'feral' wasn't the best choice of words. Zsazsa, in common with the others, hadn't been sufficiently socialised. The others responded better than Zsazsa. She did respond, but reacted badly to having a litter in new surroundings. Charlie has already said that, with hindsight, he would have waited another year before letting any of the new Saarloos intake have a litter, but he took into account that they only come into season every 12 to 14 months and they were not young bitches.

As said in my earlier post, I have two Saarloos crosses with temperaments to die for, and I have encountered several others that have all had fantastic temperaments.

It's a shame because it was a total betrayal of trust by a 'loyal employee' that resulted in the whole thing surfacing. Had the truth surfaced, fine. But it was a version of the truth that had him lose patience, get his shotgun and shoot one of his dogs. That actually didn't happen. After several days of heartsearching, a professional slaughterman was engaged. But several people have it in for Charlie and will use any means, fair or foul, to besmirch him.

Some of you are anti commercial breeders, full stop. Personally I would rather have one expert breeder produce twenty litters a year than have twenty enthusiastic but clueless amateurs producing one litter each. But I guess that's a different argument for another time.

I don't recall that version, is that really being claimed?

But he's shown he's not an expert breeder by his actions breeding these girls

Thanks for trying to clarify. Hindsight is a great thing and I appreciate how difficult all this is for those concerned. I do commend Charlie if he has now realised that he might have waited another year but really all the signs were there to loudly scream not breeding from ZsaZsa or any of them at this time. The time they had been in this country before he started trying was far too short and with too many unknowns. They needed time to settle and the timing of their seasons should not have been the deciding factor.

Yes. Charlie and Sandra have both been very critical of inbreeding in NIs. Inbreeding will not happen in the Saarloos or the Saarloos crosses. That assumes that no irresponsible owner does anything stupid a couple of generations down the line, of course. Another argument for commercial breeders rather than amateurs...

because likes so many others charlie has belived the lies and rumours said about me and has "slagged " me off on his forum, banning me so i can not defend myself.
i do however think he was wrong to breed from them all so early especially genova.

Well then you need to ensure water-tight contracts and to keep future pups and owners under your wing - you should advise on appropriate matings. Admittedly, this is not 100% bullet proof if someone decides to go off on a wild one.

I'm sorry Bob, I don't know what went on. I don't think anyone does but if this is all a misunderstanding, you should go and talk to him and sort it out.

just to clarify zsazsa was the only one that let charlie near her and have contact with

i have tried talking to him, i even tried before i left