What makes a breed a 'breed'? Discussions

Aww bless him, I will be waiting. Time bleddy flies, can't believe he's 5 months already

Good morning all!

Found the quote last night, i will include the whole passage so it flows better. so here goes:

'Drivers liked to work with large dogs because they often carried loads one ans a half times heavier than their teams. Newfoundlands st. bernards and hounds were popular imports, and they were crossbred with the indigenous dog population. In Nome, the imports were bred with malamutes, named after the Eskimo Mahlemuit people. Over the past sevral hundred years, the eskimos had used and bred their dogs to freight heavy loads for relatively short distances. When miners crossbred the native dogs with newfoundlands and st bernards, the outcome was sometimes astonishing: Mutts that weighed as much as 125 pounds. The malamute nearly disappeared, yet its name lived one; miners in Nome as well as in the interior often called there mixed-bred dogs malamutes.' the cruellest miles page 20.

Another interesting passage is:

'The demand for sled dogs was so high particulary during the northern gold rushes, that the supply of dogs ran out and a black market for the animals sprang up in the states. Any dog that looked as if it could pull a sled or carry a saddlebag - whether or not it was suited to withstand the cold - was sold in the north. 'it was said no dog larger then a spaniel was considered safe on the streets' of west coast port towns said one sled dog historian.' also from the cruellest miles.

Why is that interesting? Is it because people now think that any dog can pull a rig or scooter?

Calm down dear!

I meant it's interesting from a historical point of view, going back to an earlier part of the thread. Malady was asking me what i had been reading, i said i would include some direct quotes from the book i was refering too.

I find the history of dogs very interesting, the pictures of the old sled dogs on the serum run, look nothing like the KC pure bred dogs we have today.

I know what you mean i don't think Togo and Liska, two dogs used to set the husky breed standard for recognition, would do very well in the show ring today.

Totally calm dear!

just wondering if that was some justification as to why NI owners want to work their dogs on scooters or rigs if they don't want sled dogs

I think NI owners who do this do it because both they and the dogs enjoy it! Purposely-bred sled dogs are not for all as I'm sure you'd agree. A NI is bred to be a companion but is a very versatile dog and many of them LOVE pulling - so why not let them?

Because constructionally they aren't built to do so

Someone said..I bought an NI cos I don't want a sled dog then go on to make them do what sled dogs are meant for!
Just doesn't make sense

A mal is bred to be a sled dog but makes a fabulous companion.. lots of people haev competed them in agility and obedience so they are also very versatile..

BUT if they aren't trying to make NI sled dogs..then why ask them to do sled dog work?

I think the key point is that they are not 'worked' on rigs ect its done for fun and excerise. If the dog enjoys it and the dog is not being put at risk then why can't any breed do it?

umm just had a mental image of poodles pulling a rig . . .

Hmmmm wasn't there a show who had Phil Dixon from Culpeppers doing a "WORKING" demonstration??

And also.. I refer to working as them having a harness on and attached to something they are pulling..

The differentiation to me is COMPETE or for fun..BUT either way they are being worked....

A quote from the pawtrekker website

Can my dog pull me on a scooter?
If your dog can run, then they run using a scooter! Smaller dogs will just need more help from you, especially uphill – so you’ll get more of a workout too!

Of course you don't need a husky or malamute to use a scooter. My dogs do it because they love it, its great exercise and good fun.

For the same reason some Mal owners ask their dogs to do agility and obedience. Are they trying to make Mals agility and obedience dogs?

Great!!.Of course they are a company who want to sell their scooters who whoever will part with money!

But then why deny you want a sled dog when what you are doing is essentially what a sled dog is built for??

and why have a working demo at an NI show??

If the fact they are supposed to be a sled dog (as per wiki standar) then I would think this would have to be added into the current NI standard as NI don't resemble a working breed at all

But agility and obedience are open to ALL dogs as they are an activity..not anything that a breed is bred for!

Show me a breed that was bred for obedience or agility??

Mals were bred to pull heavy sleds over long distances

What was bred to jump over jumps and play on see saws?

Aah yes, as I said I've read it many times, and I thought you were saying that Malamutes of today were a result of crossbreeding with european dogs ! The fact is that the astonishing mutts that resulted from the crossbreeding rarely worked well, and the woman who got the breed recognised actually took what remaining purebred Malamutes she could find, then added to them with others she found throughout the States owned by different people. Of course the remaining ones that Paul Voelker found also (mainly from the Army) were bred from also, which established the breed back to good numbers. So no, the Malamute isn't a result of crossbreeding, only the Malamutes that remained were used in a breeding programme to get them recognised

I don't recall anyone saying they thought the NI was supposed to be a sled dog, they are not. I have no idea who put that on the wiki site. I haven't looked at it but if you want to take what that says as fact then thats up to you.

Using a scooter is a small part of many things our dogs do. If they didn't enjoy it then they wouldn't do it. Same as anything else. To me it doesn't matter what breed of dog you have. If the dog enjoys and is good at something then I can't see the problem.

I have a picture of Poodles pulling a rig, working, somehwere, will dig it out !