Working line German shepherds Working Dogs

It's not on the KC database or on the pedigree link attached to the website, that aside a hip score of 20/2??? If a show kennel was found out to have used a dog at stud with that sort of hip score there'd be Hell on!

I just find people who health test, get bad results and then ignore the results just as bad as people who don't even bother to test regardless of "hobby".

I suppose what I'm getting at is don't get carried away with the cuteness of puppies, if the parents aren't adequately health tested walk away, but I'm sure you know that!

Anyway, ignore me, back on topic we go!

i know i cant have one just yet anyway, and im a sucker for cute puppies no matter what the breed

Fortunately there are plenty of working line GSD breeders who do not have repeat accidental matings and who only breed from dogs with good hip/elbow scores.

From what I have heard, Damian is quite a special dog in terms of drive as well as temperament and pedigree - so perhaps that is why he has been bred from?

I can't say for sure, but will certainly ask Nyrvana and find out.

But what about health ? Does not matter how good a drive a dog has , with such a bad hip score , why would using him at stud be excused?

Not much point in going to the trouble of testing then ignore the results .

This seems to be a popular reasoning behind such matings though sadly (not just talking WL GSD).

Neither Damian nor the bitch have any qualifications, nor do their parents....................

I have had a reply from Nyrvana to say ...

Damian is not haemophilia tested, I stopped doing that some years ago since all the haemophiliac dogs come from one source and no new sources have ever been found. Since you can see by looking at the pedigree if a dog is haemophiliac, I know it is not possible for any of my dogs to be one, I can't see the point of doing a redundant test. This is common knowledge and unless a new source appears I will not test.

Damian's hip score is over breed average by a couple of points, we do not know why it is so uneven, he is from a very strong hip background and compared to what he has to offer it would be silly to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I seldom get poor hip results and get good dogs because I look at the big picture, breeding is not a numbers game. Of course we would have been delighted if Damians hip score had been even, but that is luck, we have no idea why it should be so extreme in difference.

Anyway, as always, if someone gets a dog from me and it turns out to have hip/elbow problems, I'll give them another as and when they are ready for one and I've only had to do that 3 times I think in over 30 years so I'm not so far off the mark.

Perhaps you should take it up with Nyrvana.

Er why?

I could not care less about their dogs I am never likely to get a dog from them so it is of little interest to ME how "special" their dog is alleged to be.

Words fail me tbh. The dog suffers, but it's ok because the owners won't? It's all very well reimbursing the puppy owner, but what about the poor puppy bred with a health defect that could at least attempt to be prevented by testing? Just because there have been no problems does not mean they will never/do not exist.

Every dog is special in some way, but that does not mean every special dog should be bred from. Especially when it isn't appropriately health tested.

It still amazes me that show breeders are the lowest of the low, yet working breeders can do these things and no one bats an eyelid, because the dog has a special kind of drive......

Not aimed at you Moobli, more rhetorical than anything.

I am not sure where you get the idea that any of the above assertions are upheld by all responsible breeders either show or working or purchasers.

I certainly DO bat an eyelid, and this dog does not have a "special kind of drive" nor any other qualities "unique" to him, the GSD or the breed in the UK or elsewhere.

It is certainly not the view of the majority of working breeders I know.

Is it odd that the hipscore is so uneven? Would this be more likely to be indicative of an injury rather than a purely genetic element? Or is this uneveness often seen in hipscoring?

Could be either.

My generalised idea's come from my, very special, generalised brain.

Now look, I am now issuing you with a CAUTION notice, for

APOSTROPHE ABUSE!

Eh I was looking for a more interesting answer than that!!!!

I have never abused any apostrophe, I luv's them.

Words fail me too...........just another excuse from someone breeding from unsuitable dogs

One would expect if such an uneven score was due to injury the owner would know what caused it , but as the breeder says.........

So you would have to assume its due to other factors, (genetic) and should be avoided from the breeding pool, a tall costs.........