Suggetions, please on new dog. Which breed for me?

My husband and I are researching potential dog breeds that would be a good match for us. After reading a number of breed profiles, I’m strongly leaning towards a standard poodle. I’ve searched through this forum for similar situations, but haven’t found anything that really mirrors our circumstances. Here’s a little bit about us and what we’re looking for in a dog.

Whether you have had dogs previously
My husband has been around various large breeds all his life: German Shepherd, husky, Labrador retriever. My family had a high-strung, aggressive cocker spaniel when I was in high school, and she is the exact opposite of what we’re looking for.

Your circumstances - do you work etc?
We both work full-time, but slightly staggered hours. Our dog would be alone approximately 7 hours a day, with mid-day visits from me, (possibly) my mother-in-law, or dog walker; occasional visits to doggie day care isn’t out of the question. Eventually, we’d like to get two dogs, but I’ve read that getting littermates or two dogs at the same time is not a good idea.

How much time you have for exercise
We’d be able to provide about 30 min. morning & 45-60 min. evening most days, more on weekends. I like to walk (I’ve mapped out a 3.5 mile route through our neighborhood) and I’m sure I can learn to play fetch. We have a decent sized yard that will be fenced by the time a dog comes to live with us. I don’t know that I will ever consider myself an athlete, but I would welcome becoming more active and fit. We also have a local dog park.

Whether you have children, other pets etc
No children, infrequent visitors, no other pets. As mentioned, we’d like to get a second dog at some point. After having a cantankerous cat for 16 years, we’re well aware of the need for proper socialization.

What characteristics you are looking for
Size – We’d like a medium-sized dog, approximately 40-70 lbs. Bigger is ok.

Coat – Although neither my husband nor I are allergic to dogs, we do have other environmental allergies. A low shedding breed would be preferable.

Temperament – Definitely an easy going, friendly, fairly easy to train, not overly stubborn, non-aggressive dog. I realize that some of that comes with training, but in my research I’ve seen some breeds identified as “not for novice owners” or “tends to be stubborn” or “can be difficult to train.” I would be with the dog most often, take it on some morning and all evening walks, and would be responsible for grooming. Given my lack of dog experience and somewhat small size (5’2”, 100lbs) I’d like a dog that’s easy to handle and train.

Watch / Guard dog – I’d like a dog who would be alert to strange noises, but not one who will bark at every noise. I’m not so much interested in a dog who would guard our home, but it wouldn’t be a bad trait.

What breeds you have already looked at and your thoughts on them
We’ve considered some of the giant breeds (e.g., St. Bernard, Newfies), but decided they are too big. Their laid back temperament is appealing, but as mentioned, we’re not opposed to becoming more active. Golden retrievers and labs generally have the right temperament, but shed quite a bit and often have a little too much doggy odor. We’re strongly leaning towards a standard poodle.

Anything else you think might be relevant or important
Separation anxiety is a potential big issue. Our dog would be alone approximately 7 hours a day, with mid-day visits from me, (possibly) my mother-in-law, or dog walker; occasional visits to doggie day care isn’t out of the question. Eventually, we’d like to get two dogs, but I’ve read that getting littermates or two dogs at the same time is not a good idea.

We’re willing to groom as necessary, attend obedience school, and participate in other activities (e.g., advance obedience). I don’t foresee participating in competitions, but stranger things have happened. The intelligence of the poodle is both an attraction and a potential concern in terms of separation anxiety and boredom. We both have undergrad degrees in psychology, so are familiar with the principles of classical and operant conditioning.

Many thanks for any advice you can offer.

Standard poodles are great dogs! And seem to fit your requirements but is it a puppy you want to get? Your set up would be fine for an older dog but not a puppy imho

To be brutally honest, no puppy would be suitable to be left for 7 hours a day & I certainly would not be happy for a puppy of mine to live as a member of a household with your routine. Puppies need 4 meals a day from 8 weeks of age, they need socializing extensively, they need to be toilet trained hourly during the day for the first couple of months.

As to an adult, possibly if it was already used to being left or kennelled for long periods.

I would not advise a highly intelligent breed like a standard poodle for such a lifestyle

It would not be possible to toilet train a puppy properly with your lifestyle, neither would it be possible to put in the level of socialisation and habituation required for it to become a competent and confident adult, therefore it would be wise to seek an older dog ie at least a year old who has been used to being left in order to maximise the success of your plan and the happiness of all.

I think if you could arrange for the pup to either go to your mother in laws or maybe to doggy day care etc, for at least 4-5 hours whilst you are away from the house for the first 5-6 months then that could work.

It is not really fair to leave a pup alone for 7 hours a day in the early days, house training would be very hard and the poor pup would be quite lonely. The max i would leave a pup would be 3-4 hours daily.

Aside from that, a standard poodle seems to fit the bill, they are fantastic dogs!

I seem to be at odds with everyone here. I`ve known 4 Standard poodles. All have been driven, worky, highly intelligent and therefore the opposite of laid back.
Just my experience.
I would never leave poodle - especially a youngster - alone for any length of time btw. This is a very clever breed who do not tolerate boredom.
They need a lot of grooming, and regular clipping.
Not a breed for people who want an easy dog IMO.

If you want an unbiased view on the breed (or any breed) phone the Poodle Rescue people. They will give you the downsides as well as the good bits. http://poodlesinneed.com/Canyouofferahome.aspx

My aunt had standard Poodles. They are extremely clever dogs that need quite a bit of mental stimulation. Personally I would not advise leaving one of this breed alone for several hours in the way you describe. I think a standard Poodle might well also need more exercise than you can offer at present.

I would advise against a Lab or Golden Retriever too. I have a Lab and trust me - they need far, far more than the exercise you describe. They can also be very destructive if left alone for hours at a time. Ditto for the Goldens.

As others have said, no puppy could be left alone for that many hours. You would run the risk of ending up with a very unhappy, poorly socialised dog - and this would lead to massive problems for you. It would also be unfair on the puppy to leave it alone for that long.

Have you considered a rescue/retired Greyhound? They are very laid back, don't need massive amounts of exercise, and as they would not be puppies it would be easier to leave them for a few hours.

I agree with Claire about Standard Poodles. The ones I know around here are very boisterous dogs who give my equally boisterous dog a real run for her money. Standards can also be highly strung and probably would not do well in a situation where they are to be left for long periods.

A young Lab or Golden can be energetic and destructive, yes. An older mature Lab or Golden, well, you'd struggle to find an easier dog. Obviously there are exceptions -- but they are not as popular as they are because they are incredibly difficult and demanding. A mature Lab or Golden from a breed specific rescue (breed rescues may be more accommodating to the fact you both work full time) could work. My Labradors past and present, as MATURE dogs, would be absolutely fine with the OP's routine, as would the many mature Labs and Goldens I know.

I guess it depends on how we define 'mature'.

The mature Labs that I know still need quite a bit more exercise than the OP says would be on offer.

Also, I am not saying that Labs and Goldens are destructive, per se. I am simply suggesting that a Lab may not appreciate being left for seven hours, daily, and may as a result become destructive.

4-5+ is when both of these breeds typically tend to slow down, so I consider that a 'mature' adult. Labs and their crosses are just as numerous as they are in the USA as they are here, so a mature rescue will not be hard to come across.

The OP is willing to give 1 1/2 hours of exercise a day. If it was good structured exercise (and a mixture of exercises), I don't see that as being 'too little' for any breed of dog on a daily basis. Your average pet Labrador in your average home probably does not receive anywhere near that amount on a daily basis.

The dog will not be left for 7 hours continuously though. The OP is arranging for someone (herself, dog walker, etc.) to come in at lunch time and presumably spend time with and/or walk the dog.

You're not at odds with me

Well, that`s relief!
Sorry for skimming.

St. Poodles are awesome dogs! However if they get bored, they'll find something to do... usually not what you want them to do! They do not like being alone, And can be very wound up and hyper. I raised and trained a st. poodle... she was almost never alone, and got to the dog park for at least 2 hours a day... plus she (we) lived on 3 acres... and she still had energy to burn! I did agility classes with her, and tracking, as well as a ton of obedience. and she was a certified therapy dog. but she was a TON of work. And one of the best dogs I've had the privilege of knowing! Sadly, she passed away at 6 with an undiagnosed disease... even the autopsy didn't reveal what was wrong with her... poor baby.

Thank you for the comments. It sounds as though you're saying that no one who works full-time should have a dog...

I'd like to clarify that I never said that a puppy would be left home for 7 hours. We would make necessary arrangements (vacation time, work-from-home, dog sitter) to ensure a puppy receives appropriate care (feeding, potty breaks, socialization, training).

Here is a proposed weekday schedule for an adult dog:

~5am – I wake up, potty break, play in the yard (possibly a short walk depending on the time of year and light), breakfast, brief training session

~6:30 – I leave for work; dog in bedroom with my husband

~7 – husband up, another potty break, play in yard or walk, training

~9-9:30 – husband leaves for work; dog confined to family & laundry rooms

~12:30 – my lunch break; home for 30-45 minutes, potty break, some play in yard and/or training

~4/4:30 – I’m home from work; potty & long walk or dog park, training sessions, general together time

~7:30/8 – husband home from work; some play or training, more together time

Sounds absolutely fine for an adult dog. You have obviously put a lot of thought into this.

Any other breed take your fancy apart from a Standard Poodle?

If I were you, I'd be tempted to go along to your local rescue shelters (check if they have any blanket policies about amount of time dogs are able to be left first) and let the staff match you up with appropriate dogs.

Thanks! I love the idea of rescuing a dog, but we had a bad experience recently and my husband isn't too keen on trying again. I could probably get him to agree to a dog if the background we known (e.g., a dog returned to the breeder for rehoming).

We've considered labs and goldens, but the fur and smell issues.

Other dogs we've considered -
soft-coated wheaten terriers - too feisty even though they're supposed to be less terrier-like

Portuguese water dog - have read that they're not recommended for novice owners

Greyhounds meet some criteria, but I just don't like them - too skinny and the ones I've met have been high-strung

So what are your plans for the puppy stage?

Btw not keen on fur and smell? That's dogs really ;-)

What about an adult big dog cross.. Such as newfie, St Bernard, Bernese, Leonberger etc. I notice you said you liked them, so one crossed with another breed would probably be smaller (big still pretty big) and more relaxed than something like a poodle. Plus potentially less health issues. I've heard something about 'Borderneses' - Border Collie X Bernese becoming more popular.. although I would have thought with the collie this would be a bit much for you. I'm sure there must be some big crosses in rescue, or on a rehoming site (not neccesarily a rescue).

Reading your schedule though it sounds like, if that was all feasable, you have quite a lot of time to put in to a dog and their training.

Ahh, but most rescues are in rescue through no fault of their own. I'm not sure what your 'bad' experience was, but there are plenty of rescue dogs with known backgrounds (eg; the reason(s) they came to rescue and their history are known). Good rescues should also temperament test prior to re homing. Getting a dog that has been fostered is also an option.

As for Labs and Goldens fur issues, the majority of dogs shed, so by only looking at non-shedding breeds you are really limiting yourself.

As for smell, that tends to differ from individual to individual dog rather than breed. Some dogs naturally smell more doggy than others and it is often just luck of the draw!