Are bulldogs actually bulldogs ? Controversial

So we all know british, dorset, olde type recreation bulldogs couldn't do a days graft in their life doing realbulldog work like catching a bull or a boar due to the way they have been selectively bred losing height, strength, breathing ability, jaw strength and most importantly the temp etc for nothing more than to look good to certain people.

For instance a dog fitting the Kc standard SBT is no longer a pit dog so isn't called a "pit" bull terrier which it once was as it's now just a show dog quite removed from the pit in phenotype aswell as genotype due to breeding away from the qualities it once needed to compete in it's original field so they changed the name.

Do you think a breed like the recreation bulldogs that can't perform the original tasks it was originally bred for deserve to still be named as the same breed when there is real bulldogs out there in USA, Aus and the Eu doing real bulldog work and earning their right to be named a BULLDOG ?

So are the "real" Buldogs catching much boar and bulls these days??

There probally is some catching wild boar, I think I saw a pic on a hunting site a couple of years ago of two bull type dogs hunting one, not sure about the bulls though :? , although tbh most references online of boar hunting are with hounds who are used more to find the boar then anything else.

ETA I did find a site about hog hunting, but I'm not sure whether to put it up, maybe with a warning that the background picture may upset a few people, and maybe a couple of others, although apart from a couple American bulldogs, they all seem like crosses to me?

http://hesseltinekennels.webs.com/

Well yes they are used every day in USA, Aus and in the EU for feral pig controll and on farms etc. I have plenty of evidence if your doubting what I'v said as I know for the general public it's probably not something they read about everyday!!

I'm not trying to wind people up either as I can imagine this could ruffle a few feathers, just starting a debate.

Hounds find the boar and bay it (basically circle it and stop it from running) then the bulldog is sent in to catch either on the cheek or ear and hold untill the hunter can dispatch the quarry.

Hounds haven't usually got the grit to catch a big boar but some will and do try but the mortality rate is alot higher in catchy hounds than bulldogs so that trait is bred away from.

Tbh with the amount of hunting debates that have been on already maybe it wont do it so much, IDK, although if it does maybe it would be better to start a hunting boar with dogs thread aswell as this one, but lets not worry about that yet

odd question :?

some sled dogs never do a days work in harness either,does that mean they shouldnt be classed as such :?

Tbf you'll probally find the dogs that you consider proper bulldogs will be named as something else by the people who own them so that there dogs aren't confused with the bull dogs around today, just like when I read the terrier mans article the other day, about how I think it was jack russels were called Fox terriers, but after showing came into it, and the show fox terrier wasn't that great at working, the JRT's were renamed to stop any confusion (more the working peeps not wanting it ) but if a dog has been called a name for a long time then I don't think it will change, whether it can or can't, or does or doesn't do what it was originally bred for.

On the continent bulldogs are not needed to catch wild boar.

The hunter shoots it, if it is not killed instantly then dogs such as Weimaraners, GLPs, BMH will track the animal until they find it, they then return to the hunter holding a bringsel in its mouth to indicate the quarry has been found.

More humane than getting a dog to get hold of it.

Yes SmokeyBear obviously not every boar hunter in the world uses a catch dog but wether it's more humane or not they are used on the continent so are doing real bulldog work in the EU!!

So your saying a pig laying there bleeding to death from a gunsot wound that didn't kill it for aslong as it takes for the hunters dog to track then return to the hunter and then show the hunter where it is for the hunter to dispatch is better than a catch dog catching holding onto it (not fighting it) then a hunter dispatching it straight away usually with a knife to the heart or spinal cord ? I thought the aim was to dispatch as soon as possible to stop the animal from suffering.

My thoughts too.

Maybe the Doberman should be renamed too, as my guess is there is no longer any need for them to protect the tax man when he is collecting his duty.

From what I have seen, most of the "alternative" Bulldogs are as far removed from the original anyway, so it seems all immaterial to suggest they are more capable to hunt boar and bulls ...

My guess would be, any one who puts a dog up against a wild boar is doing it for one reason only.....blood lust!

Yeh or to just catch it to stop it doing damage to their farm/land aswell as putting some food on the table, oh and to keep real bulldogs around and not letting them die out and become imitation show bred crap..

So when I take my JRT's ratting or I take my ferrets rabbiting I'm doing so for blood lust am I, Or is that just for people that control wild boar with their dogs ?

Real Bulldogs

More real bulldogs


Notice none look anything like the dogs we call bulldog dayin day out!!

they look terrible. covered in scars,

Most working dogs are!! Part and parcel of the job.

Even little terriers that just hunt rats have scars on their lips/face.

They'd definately lose points in a show ring though the poor lads lol

I know where you are coming from regards the bulldog but personally i would'nt class the dogs in the photo's as bulldogs.I would move away from being breed specific and more openly call them catch dogs bred for purpose regardless of what breed or breeds they are made up of.

Have you ever been deer stalking, stag hunting or hunted wild boar?

Can you tell me what the difference is in time between:

Hunter catching up with wounded pig whilst it is being held by a dog and

Hunter catching up with wounded pig when no dog is holding it there?

Sometimes dogs remain with the pig and bay "totverbellen" so that the hunter follows the sound.

So if you could explain to me how one method is quicker than the other and more humane for the pig, I would like to understand it before I tackle some other points.

thank you.

They pic of the first two look like cracking Abs.
The pic of the others have obv been taken just after a hunt, they dont look great do they. I reckon after a good bath they would proberly not look as bad , hopefully poor fellas. The one with a tan patch looks more pitbull terrier, just my humble opin.
What lines are the ABs pictured?

Looking at the boar sites and some of those Aussie pig dogs look amazing ...

Now they seem bred for purpose ...

I would say the four pictured together the one with the tan patch is the only one that does not look like a pitbull terrier.

They don't look happy and they look like they have skin problems.

All my dogs are KC show dogs.

Some of them could likely do what they were originally bred for some may be a bit lazy.
Could I prove it ? No way. Nor would I want to.

While you say you don't want to ruffle feathers you are being rude about all show dogs.
Which is as bad as believing BSL is right.