Cross breeding Controversial

Thank you.

If they ticked all MY boxes which is impossible to see from the site then I might consider it if I WANTED what they produced------can you now answer my question please?

Also---what do you think ought to happen to the pups they produce and what are you doing about stopping this activity apart from writing on forums? That is a genuine question---NOT a dig.

rune

Unfortunately there is not a lot I can do about the pups they are producing as they are fully licensed etc..
I am a member of the WAG( Waterside Action Group) and I try and educate the public--now that is the difficult part especially when ya read that some people should know better but would still line breeders like this pockets just because they seem to tick all the boxes health, temprement, socialisation etc...wise

I don't think anyone on here has said they would buy from this breeder based on the info given alone have they?

You see IF they ticked all those boxes that I mentioned can you tell me why it is any different from buying from a big pedigree/working dog breeder? Is it JUST that the dogs they produce are not 'pure'? Is it that they are making dogs into a commercial commodity? Is it that they get rid of their brood bitches when they have finished with them? Is it that they don't show or work the dogs? Do you think the dogs are badly treated?

rune

Are they not a commercial business??
Have no idea if they get rid of their Brood Bitches
According to their site they appear to work their dogs
IMO Their Dogs would fall into the badly treated catagory in my eyes due to the large number of litters they have.
They state they are breeding for the pet market --no way are their dogs pets in my eyes--just breeding machines to increase their bank balance

True but they have not said they would not either!!!

I have not looked at the site - how many litters do the bitches have?

What to do is look and then keep checking back and then ya will be able to work it out Easy
I could tell ya what I know but that is only from doing the above, so no proof to any number I post here as new litters advertised constantly so old adverts removed

From what you have written I would not call them ethical Crossbreeders.....but then - I already said that.

However - IF I started a thread about pedigree breeders...I have no doubt that someone could come up with a similar example against Pedigree breeding, as you have provided to plead your case against crossbreeding.

This thread was not about a specific breeder - it was about the overall thoughts of crossbreeding and if it could be seen as ethical or having a place in society.

Have to go train some dogs now.....will see how this thread has progressed when I get home

I dont understand why when cross breeders are mentioned it becomes them VS pedigree breeders. Most have said before that they feel just the same about pedigree breeders who are doing the same. Most dont agree with pedigree breeders breeding for the sake of it - like wise with cross breeders.

I also still dont understand how someone passionate about a breed can cross them.

How they can breed so much.

Have so many puppies advertised - when claming these dogs are so sought after. As then their not really supplying a demand are they..Their supplying and advertising waiting for that demand? :?

Also most must be using poor examples of their breed? I mean what show/working person would sell pups on to be cross bred? none I know. or they have just brought from another pet breeder, and carrying on the circle, or maybe kept one they bred themselves. Do they even consider the quality of the dogs...or does it not matter as they are not going back to the same breed? Maybe thats why the cross them, because they have a poor example of the breed and no one would stud them out a dog of the same breed??

You ask what are people doing other than "writing on forums" about puppy farmers,

Well I may be wrong, but taking a stance on NOT BUYING from such places is a step in the right direction.

Something sadly it seems Rune, you dont seem to have a problem with, you ask others to step up, yet you are quiet willing to support such breeders, if they tick your boxes, but you have also said in the past, you would buy from a PF, if they has what you wanted, with no mention of any boxes being ticked.

Thankfully most see them for what they are, but I guess you will always get someone who ignores all the evidence, if they have what they want.

Degrees of ethics here!


Disagree, what ethics could you possible say , these breeders hold,

Some of their info on their site.

they only do F2`s...

So they have no interest is "bettering their new breed"

Complement each other thats a joke right, can someone please tell me how a Clumber Spaniel, and a Standard Poodle can possible complement each other.

I have provided information from someone who does indeed breed Pedigree as well as Crossbreeds, so link would be the same on Pedigree Thread.

I am totally against any "commercial" breeding per se and imo most of these types are Crossbreeders at the moment as they are seemingly the "in thing" in some people's minds especially when ost of the Crossbreeders spout crap as to why have a Crossbreed rather than a Pedigree

If there was no demand they wouldn't exist, all commercial concerns need some kind of advertising---even if it is just word of mouth.

Do you think ANY big breeder with many litters is not ethical?

rune

Rune you keep saying big breeders..Define that for me?

LOL Do not forget they state they will be easier to train!!

As for making an Ass of themselves lol

We do not breed beyond F2 as we believe that by doing this you are recreating the very pedigree monster you are trying to get away from

THEY BREED PEDIGREE MONSTERS ALSO LOL

Hope ya get an answer of Rune's definition of a Big Breeder as I have already asked lol

Or if people were more educated there would not be the demand, some posts on here shows me that this will never happen

For JB.

I happen to think that once a pup is born it deserves a home regardless of who bred it and if they are making money from it. That to me is THE most important thing.

I had no reason in the past to even consider that there might be people who were not 'puppy farmers' in the accepted sense of the word and who were legal, registered, clean, feeding good quality food, with puppy contracts, health tested and to most people very acceptable breeders of whatever pups happened to be their choice.

I haven't looked at the website for the cloodles just gone on what was said---which seemed to be that it ticked a lot of my boxes----obviously not all of them.

I personally wouldn't give any deposit and wouldn't get any pup without having seen it at the least. However I do know of other breeders who ask for deposits.

Having said all that I would also defend my right and the rights of anyone else to get a pup/dog from anywhere legally producing them.

Get ALL commercial breeders shut down and thats fine by me but don't discriminate against the breeders of crosses as oppose to the big breeders of labs/springers/collies etc.

rune

I think it would be anyone who has so many that they need staff, produces more than a couple of litters a year and can't give the time to pups to give them the experiences and handling they need.

What would your definition be?

rune

But the 'education' provided by the organisation you mentioned doesn't allow for the breeders I am talking about. They fall between two stools----they are not the unacceptable face of puppy farming but they are not private breeders either.

What do you want to educate everyone to do? Do you want to stop ALL commercial breeding?

rune