What other wolf crosses have their been Discussions

THis was my understanding as well - but I looked at it with Mules and Hinnies!
Although I do not think the females are always sterile, but they can be mated back to a Stallion (horse or donkey)

Here you go.

Its not possible according to what Ive been told, and what Ive read, and it doesnt explain why the chap I know has this Fox, a female who hasnt been spayed and his male Terriers show no interest in her. Id also think there would be an awful amount of dogs taking off after "in season" female Foxes if this was possible. Id appreciate the info Nikki please from your friend.

Don't hold your breath Dawn, but I'll do my best !

Nite one n'all x

Nope---the hype is on the net sites and around the dog world generally.

rune

Off Topic but different species can interbreed and produce viable (i.e. surviving) young, hence horse/donkey, lion/tiger, sheep/goat hybrids however in the main the males are always sterile which means a new species cannot be created as only mating back to one of the parent breeds is possible. This is due to the fact that these species have different numbers of chromosomes.
Becky

Hi Im back , bet you thought you had scared me off?? Nope wee sis was up for the weeklend and spent it drinknig lots and lots of "vin rouge" and talking mince..

Anyway to re-iterate:

Dawn I never once said all the list of 10 ethical breeders were in the same club as me did I, and no I didnt put surnames up
1 I have a terrible memory with names
2 They are easily found if you cut through the "hype" all over the internet

There are also many more I havent listed, all pet breeders (ie do not breed large scale/ home bred)
They all health test the parents, the pups are screened and they all abide by KC breeders code of ethics, yes they do beleive it or not even though they are not KC registered dogs, some of us are KC registered with our pedigrees and therefore have to abide by KC rules regardless as we have things such as affixes, accredited breeder etc etc...just thought I better clarify incase the "sensitive, special Rune goes off on one and accuses me of misleading you all " sorry geezer, I will do penance to the statues I promise..

Also on the point of the showing and the rules

Main Entry: accordance
Part of Speech: noun
Definition: agreement
Synonyms: accord, conformance, conformation, conformity, congruence, congruity, consensus, consonance, correspondence, harmony, unison
Notes: something (a quality) is in accord with something else; something acts in accordance with something else (an activity)

For Rune as you will see above "accordance" means that we run our shows with the same rules as the KC shows are run (that is wether we have applied for the license or not)
Reason being is
1 to ensure the dogs welfare always comes first
2 As we hope in the future to be recognised we feel that everything should be done with this in mind.

Also I did speak to the Kennel Club licensing department myself a few years ago and they themselves seemed happy enough about what we are doing as is all our members....

As for misleading people??? If it is stipulated that we are not recognised, EVERYWHERE, how on earth do you feel misled, take example:

My bitch has been shown against her own breed/type or whatever you feel comfortably calling it!

For 3 years she has beaten dogs of her type and gained best of breed/best in show, she accumulated points on her wins throughout the years to be awarded, best youngster...all the while she was expected to show against "her own type" She was judged on the breed standard stipulated for her type and has proven to be a good example of her type..


She has a clear eye test and a good hip score, she had her first litter at the beginning of the year to a Dog who has also been shown against his type all last year and accumulated points all year who actually gained the best of the year, he has been eye tested and hip scored. The pups were all eyescreened, innoculated, micro chipped, DNA profiled and were good examples of their type.

NOW if this was any other breed that was recognised...she would still have competed against the same dogs, she would still have had the same tests

I really cannot for the life of me see why you find her gaining awards "misleading" personally I think the 2 of you have a bee in your bonnet re: our type and for once you cannot find any "constructive" complaint.

Just get over it:

There are ethical breeders, there are a lot of interested people
There are records proper being created
We are going to apply for the import register
We are complying to all the requirements needed to gain recognition

If in 10 years time we have acheived what we invisage there shouldnt be any problem at all with gaining this, so really I fail to see your problem. Would you be feeling so misled if the word "wolf" was not in our types title...because all you have proven to me in this thread is the amount of PREJUDICE directed at this "type" of new breed.

As I said before the majority in BUA have already been heavily involved in pedigrees, showing, breeding and the KC and we do actually have a clue what we are doing. We are working alongside geneticists and specialists, KC give us all the advise we ask, BVA has recognised Utonagan as a breed to collate our Hip Scores, everything is moving in the right direction....

This is all fact no embellishment.....so where is any one being misled??? We are very truthful about everything, infact as I also said before the new owners are rigirously checked and told the WHOLE story of our Breed/new breed.

If you still dont "get it" then stop assuming the worse in others and back off and let those of us who do "get it" get on with our dogs.

The import register is for imported breeds only, as this will be a new breed created in this countrythen it would not be going on the import register and will initially be classed as a 'rare' breed.
Becky

yeah i thought that :? it would have to be rare wouldnt it? anyhoo good luck anyway(i do mean that im not being sarcy alady???;-) )

No ACTUALLY this is the only way a new breed can apply for recognition....silly I know as in fact we are in the UK BUT that is the way the KC do it....DO YOU NOT THINK WE HAVE CHECKED THIS ALL OUT???? GOOD GOD!

Honestly

Well they must have changed it for when the Parson Russell and Border Collie were first recognised in relatively recent times because neither of those breeds went on the import register and both are UK native breeds which yours would be!
Becky

Thanks Tupac, I kinda get the impression we need , more so from the doubting thomas brigade

WE all realise the work and time needed, in fact I may be in the happy hunting ground before they are recognised, but we are going forward and intend fully to apply, albeit we may get a couple of knockbacks in the interim...but by going in this direction it ensures records are kept, health tests are done....the dogs wether recognised or not are all looked after properly and have a good life...

You would have though those "statue" members would have been pleased about this ...

Rune,

Ok-well thats clearly not anyone's fault in particular really is it? A combination of owners talking about how great their dogs are (obviously causing "Nausea"), others slagging off the breeding, and lots of tedious politics. The latter two points seem rather prevalent in the "dog world".

I think the bottom line is- if you want one of these animals and "the dog world" is part of your social circle (i.e. dog shows and all that-I dont know if it is) you will possibly come in for criticism due to prior prejudice. The answer is not to give a flying f**k about the opinions of those you feel are prejudiced

I have not come under such "critique" whilst out walking- mainly just interest as the dogs are quite unusual looking and dare I say it "unique" up here . People ask about them and I explain positives and negatives. With particular attention to the reserve of the Saarloos.

The CW website you were talking about earlier also acts as a forum for people to discuss any behavioural problems. On top of this there is a "VET" section where advice with health issues can be sought. Surely, if breeders wished to "hype" the dogs and keep such issues under wraps these sections wouldnt exist?

Maybe you could tag team with KC Jack??

Off to the vets

Well take it up with the kennel club!! All the paper work is in my file here and I can assure you the Import register is what they require as well as an extention as they are from the UK.

I will because their policy is

which your breed/breeds do NOT comply with so they are going against their own policy/rules and regulations!
Becky

yes,the csv will hopefully be on the import reg!!!

Now that's what i like to hear, congratulations and bring on the puppy pics so we can all oo and ah over them and cheer this thread up a bit

I really dont know Malhooli, this is what the KC have given us paperwork for, if you find out different please let me know, I appreciate your help

Im sure when the time comes we may MANAGE to correspond with them further just to make sure.

Question for Alady.
If the NI gain kc recognition would that stop the Utonagan getting recognition as they came from the same dogs. Also i note T.I.D.A are hoping for recognition of Timber dogs who again will be from the same background, not sure if they hope for recognition of BI but if they do, same problem of being from the same dogs.
Where do you think the kc will draw the line as i very much doubt they will give recognition to them all.

I was wondering the same as you. Would it be the first club to get recognition with the kc, say for example timber wolf dogs would they all have to be called timber wolves to register.