What other wolf crosses have their been Discussions

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Yes

Now does anyone know how many there are now?

Well since the most percent of slagging on this particular thread was directed towards a WOlf Dog breeder as someone recently pointed out... not wolfalike?? Of course the Ute comes under the wolfalike bracket, be kinda stupid if it didnt??

And as far as I am aware there has been 1 breeder who has been proven unethical in her practises Nadia Carlyle, in the Utonagan??? Please inform me if I am indeed wrong and you know of any other?? with factual statistics please

I would be happy if you gave your own input as to if you feel the wolfalike is a good idea or not and your reasons why?? I would be interested to hear these points of view without the squabbling

Absolutely, over a year ago and if you managed to find the web-site maybe you should go and read up as it states on it also on the forum all about it, the reasons, direction and future plans. Any questions you may have AFTER you have done so I will happily answer for you.

I have nothing to bring to the thread... but i have to agree with tupacs here... i`ve just come back from a wonderful trip tp Poland.. and visited a reserve while i was there.. managed to snap a couple of pics of a european wolf while there.. i think the Czechs look almost exactly like her.

Sophia European Wolf.

Apologies for the rubbish quality of the pics.. she was a long way off and the zoom on my camera is rubbish.







her 7 week old son, who had been handreared

Its the hand rearing that I don't agree with, these poor babies will have been taken from mum, what around 10 days old, and why, so humans could coo, and fuss over them...
Mum is a beauty btw, colouring of the czech yip but head shape defo no.

Hi
I don't do slagging and squabbling
My own input into the 'wolf lookalike dog' is that it is a 'type' of dog' All the fractions and in house bickering between the groups is very off putting, also the constant name changing using the same founding dogs makes it a bit of a joke. To show you unethical practices i'd have to cut and paste, i'd also need access to all the databases and i'm sorry but i'm not prepared to spend weeks if not months pasting it all here but you could look through the threads here for starters. I think you know as well as i do that there are many breeders involved in these dogs that are unethical and not just Miss Carlyle.
Anyway yes i like the look of the dogs very much and have three of them myself. My reason for this type of dog being my choice is i wanted a husky, husky's cannot be let off lead and these guys can so for me, in my personal circumstances, were ideal. I would not say they were the ideal dog for everyone.

Thats the BEST one!!!

Any more?[/QUOTE]

With regards the bold type- How exactly do we get to new breeds without crossbreeding? Immaculate conception?

This wasn't aimed at me I know, but am going to have a go at answering it anyway.

My view on wolf lookalikes (not including wolfdog crosses).

First the dogs themselves.
Appearance absolutely gorgeous, but a very mixed bunch, and some being more wolf like than others.

Temperament.
I've only met 3 ni's, and honistly, couldn't falt them, they were lovely.

As a concept.
I can see both sides. I can understand why some people are against it, and can see why people would want to undertake it and suport it. From what I've read, the types themselves weren't given the best start. Founder dogs weren't of the highst standard, and records were lost or mixed up, or just not kept, leading to quite a bit of confusion it would seem.

People disagreed and still do, new factions were started, but rather than co-opperating, some people within those factions seem to be at war with each other.

My oppinion. I like the dogs, I think they're a bit to inconsistant in type still to be conciddered a breed yet, that goes for all, ut, ni, bi etc.

I honistly don't have a problem with new breeds being created, as long as it is done correctly. I think mistakes have been made some bigger than others.

If people want to own/breed these dogs, and do it correctly than I wish them all the success in the world for the future. I think there's still a way to go yet though.

good post tazer

Good post Tazer

Good post Tazer you have the exact same opinion as I do. I think it so sad the way these dogs havent had the best start, mainly due to people politics and I think also that it has been new breeds in a new age, ie new health testing Hips and elbows, eyes, new DNA testing by geneticists etc, it has been a more difficult task but definately for the good of the breed (thats hopefully as it all gets sorted out). In the past these tests were not available to pick the best founders of a breed, and also thankfully breeders do not cull "unsuitable puppies" any more. Therefore we are (and I say we meaning the breeders I have dealings with) promoting the breeds somewhat as they are being established as in order to create a new breed you need generations of litters, hence we need puppy owners who are looking for a pet.

Although there have been a lot of splits in past there have also over the past few years been a lot of bridge building, more honest and open records for all breeders to share. I think the main split in Utes anyway is due to differing opinions of what is the best way forward for the breed... BUA was created to move the breed forward and to start again, honesty, good records, working together, health testing all founders BEFORE breeding, etc etc.

I totally understand the opinions of the past where these dogs are concerned as I think the same, the difference being I had already got involved and fell in love with the breed We hjave came together as we are determined to do it right and give the dogs the credit they deserve. It will take time to get the type, and properly establish them as a breed, but we think it is worth the work.

I'm confused here ... with a closed gene pool then you cannot lose the wolf content ... you will continuously breed whatever % of wolf dog the Czech is, I believe it is around 28%?

But I am not sure the Czech gene pool is closed is it? The Saarloos was until the death of Saarloos - I understand that his niece has taken over since his death, so am not sure whether the pure Saarloos are still that pure if you get my meaning.

Dawn, there is one person on this earth who knows whether I have told the truth, and that is me. You can continue to libel me as much as you like, it is water off a duck's back.

You haven't been paying attention have you. My pointer rescue was not a pure pointer - she was a GSP cross labrador. My pure GSP, Lizzie, was a Wittekind GSP which held no significance or importance to me, but was very highly recognised in the GSP pedigree world.

Why do you question me? What significance is there in your questioning?

Dawn : none of these "breeds" are recognised pedigree breeds. There is nothing to stop anyone calling their crossbreed whatever damn name they choose. I describe Tai as an Alaskan Malamute cross Siberian Husky, rather than as a Utonagan. He is in fact a registered Utonagan, but I choose not to describe him as such, unless those people I am speaking to show a particular interest. The Czech and the Saarloos are recognised breeds, but all the others, the Northern Inuit, the British Inuit and all the variations therein mean absolutely nothing, they are just words in my opinion to describe a look. I see absolutely nothing wrong with this. I am not sure why you have a problem with crossbreeds in any case. You pay far less for insurance for starters, in recognition of the fact that statistically crossbreeds have far less visits to the vets than pedigrees. The insurance companies know what they are doing when they set their rates.

Who cares? They are not pedigrees, they are crossbreeds, a name is just a bunch of words.

I agree with you liz and kiesha - as with pedigree breeds, there are BAD breeders in the wolfy world, but there are also many GOOD breeders too.

Personally i dont see any difference between any of the fractions. A NI, BI and Ute all look the same type of dog, a Timber dog will look the same as all of the above. They are all just crossbreeds imo. I catagorize all of them as 'wolf lookalike dogs'

Can you name 10 good breeders please?